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Old 2021-01-07, 23:05   #51
lakinen
Default Re: Commander Improvements - Team buffs

-The command position is dead.
-No one follows unwritten rules to be respected and listened commander anymore.Almost half of the participants in this topic do the opposite.
-Nobody wants to be just a commander to place a dot marker(sitting for up to an hour)
-To go into battle kills not count.
-To use area attack anyone can.
-To put really point need teamwork....
-Who watches cowboy movies he will understand.
-And at the end the commander can be assigned a broom, to clean the deck or base


all the best


greeting



There's no real flame on your screen, it's just magic

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Old 2021-01-08, 18:40   #52
Grump/Gump.45

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Default Re: Commander Improvements - Team buffs

Quote:
Originally Posted by lakinen View Post
-The command position is dead.
-No one follows unwritten rules to be respected and listened commander anymore. Almost half of the participants in this topic do the opposite.
-Nobody wants to be just a commander to place a dot marker(sitting for up to an hour)
-To go into battle kills not count.
Essay of the day

If you want people to listen to you as commander you need to provide intel for them to listen to, there is that first simple trade off. Being a commander requires analyzing and extrapolating who, what, when, where and how intel, players, squad leaders come together on common ground. Finding the right squad leader who can accomplish something, same for individual volunteers for task requires this analyzing of what needs to be done and who can do it. Like the AA guns on Ia Drang, only needs one man to use camouflage, move cover to cover and patience to wait for moment to place C4 on AA. Not a full squad is needed to deal with them as i have seen certain squad leaders do for no reason, everyone back there gets compromised and dies.

Who you pick to do something should depend on how long you know person played or if a new player how well they learn and listen to instruction. Which long time player doesnt always mean they are good if they need claim it, just because a few times an ambush against un-skilled, outnumbered or un-prepared enemy went in their favor. They feed their own ego too easily without looking at the reality of the situation. Be careful of a squad leader or players ego, only listen to those who speak like they know the list of skills they used to win. Even if you sent one player to go do it, you should request it quietly directly to only that player and tell the player not to tell anyone where he is going. Somebody of less skill will be like "i want to go too" getting him compromised.

They dont know the standards of surviving. Anybody who claims being a long time player made them good, those who feel the need to say it cannot demonstrate it with knowledge of using or describing how skills like camouflage, awareness of enemy perceptions. You need to know each ones intelligence level. That intel also needs to be relevant priority or maybe just close to what you are asking them to do. Also lakinen i haven't seen you on in months, i remember you talking very little or it was just very basic stuff everyone says. Another thing that worked for me, I remember this Yale Course on YouTube about the American Revolution. The professor said the French General Lafayette that was sent to us said of American troops "you can give them an order and they will not carry it out until it is explained why" which applies for all humans.


It also takes convincing sometimes based off prioritization. If you want someone to listen to you without intel, it needs to be something common sense applying a better method idea than they originally had based around objective. Better yet to give them an order before they come up with their own and carry it out. I can get a squad leader to listen to taking hidden paths, ensuring camouflage is used with edge of cap. Maybe another common sense thing to ask of them is wait for another squad to join in cap zone, see if cap moves then before attacking. So it takes mental speed to think before the best quickest thinking squad leader does, knowing the squad leader and the commander has to prioritize who he talks to first before they start thinking. You cannot plan to do big things if the basics arent being ordered as common sense orders, things everybody knows by common sense, more friendly bodies than enemy in cap means you get it. Best to cap fully without fighting from edge before moving in, make sense? It does to most and they agree when the squad leaders arent noobs. Needs to be said in a well thought out sentence that delivers each key point hard, plan before saying.


Another way to work around people not listening is you could accept who doesn't listen or doesn't need to listen. Have your own respect and trust of the squad leader as a commander in the squad leaders hierarchy based how you rate their skill. Its not like the old line battles of 1800s where everything the command says goes just because he said it. Modern officers and squad leaders will risk their career for their mens lives and image to not listen to stupid orders IRL since WW1 with their high attrition rate of good officers who died. College educated idiots came along to the front or survived in the rear. Many removed from command seen as mistakes. Add on to or build other squads orders based off the squad leader who came up with his own plan cause its good. Commanders cant be selfish, its not about forcing people to listen to you based off some un-written rule everything the commander says goes just because you want to try it. Watch this video for a depiction of that commander who gets people killed when listened to.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bx10fOpl2js&t=117s Weekend at Murphy's Part 1 [halfsode]-Vet TV

Read history of officers from Lieutenant to field colonel having no respect all the way to getting fragged. Its anthropological human nature in command structure. Another video example here. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Y32VIWhJmw Hearts and Minds | A Grunt's Life Episode 2 [half o sode]-Vet TV

Once a squad leader comes up with an idea, whether its new or they use it all the time they want to try it to see how it goes that time around. Few common sense things work to get people to listen, it takes explaining and it needs to be short, simple and asked of them, not ordered or told. If you find something that works for most or all human minds write down the wording to make it better and more standardized as it develops. If you want people to listen everything you say you want them to gain respect, confidence and dependence on your better ideas. This takes time and dedication, i havent put that effort in from the commander position since 2017 when i commanded everyday for a year sometimes up to 24 hours straight on weekends. Every squad leader on at everytime got to know me.


As an individual i can get tanks to go where i want them without asking if i give them repairs from at least one logi, the tanks get cocky with it. So as a commander find a volunteer in armor squad who wants to repair tanks and watch a tank battle. An example of convincing someone with asked orders, like finding a volunteer. Its much like being a car salesmen, you have to get their mind to buy into it. To get them to drive logi to repair tanks just tell them the reality of it "you sit in view of tanks ready to save a burning tank, nothing can look at you and nothing will prioritize a logi in view of tanks unless they are smart, engine off while sitting still so no exhaust". Sweet deal right?


Find someone who likes being medic and word it as "armor medic". The kind of player who runs by when you ask for help to dig on insurgency is not a good volunteer choice because they wont do it but even if that kind of person were willing to repair tank. Not high enough intelligence level to see importance of doing the task at all or in that specific manner I described to stay alive and keep doing the task. That is common sense and reality, giving them a method to do it with. You ask "can you wait for this other squad to get equal distance from enemy flag as you on their side before moving in? thank you.". Another thing i wont listen to, commanders always tell me to go do something that gets my squad killed and takes it away from objective.


This game is not meant to do things one squad at a time against a larger force, thats a reason i personally wont listen to a commander. This game is about teamwork in the squads and among all squads, not just one squad doing one task unless its a FOB or something quick, small easy objective. If everyone is dispersed, apart of the fight, in view of at least one other squad or asset providing a distraction and division to share enemy fire and attention thats full teamwork and sharing brunt of hits plus delivering hits back.


If you apply that concept of everyone dispersed, providing a distraction and division of enemy fire and attention to open ground maps like Falklands, the guys getting shot at move zig zag or left to right of enemy fire, those not getting shot at shoot 1 or 2 shots then scoot, repeat until they are shot at. If movements are done perfectly to make the enemy miss(enemy skill/number of enemy shooters dependent) along with the people not getting shot scooting then shooting nobody dies. Then it switches off between who gets shot at naturally, not one man can run for cover or its one less distraction, everyone running away from each other in zig zag. That is highly complex and we accomplished this on the open field of Ia Drang on the creekbed once as a squad leader, JESUSLOVES was there.


I only tell people to do things to stay alive like get in edge of flag cap zone, camouflage up, wait for another squad to out cap them. Its refreshing when someone simply asks you to stay alive. We have gotten new Squad leaders over the years, rush mentality with them or some have turned hot shot and just dont listen to easy methods to cap flags. Only thing that should be rushed in this game is a cap you want to hold in beginning of game or a single neutral objective for both teams. Usually the hot shot but good squad leader go do what they do then they run out of things to do before joining the team.
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Last edited by Grump/Gump.45; 2021-01-08 at 20:02.. Reason: add video title next to video URL
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Old 2021-01-09, 17:32   #53
=-=kittykiller2
Default Re: Commander Improvements - Team buffs

lets just all agree to do something to get the commander out of main base period no essays.

access assets, on fob or vehicle or something.

or easter egg the commander with a fling function broom for pesky base campers.
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Last edited by =-=kittykiller2; 2021-01-09 at 22:58..
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Old 2021-01-11, 11:50   #54
=-=kittykiller2
Default Re: Commander Improvements - Team buffs

new thought what if he had a commander mobile like batman, but it let him do all his base stuff in field
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Old 2021-01-11, 14:50   #55
[R-MOD]Nate.
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Default Re: Commander Improvements - Team buffs

Command vehicle that prevents backcap.

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Old 2021-01-12, 01:36   #56
curahee150
Default Re: Commander Improvements - Team buffs

Just to give my two cents as a longtime PR player and someone who has been commanding a lot over the past couple of months: Commander is mostly fine, please don’t change anything too much beyond quality of life/ UI improvements.

Some things have been said about getting the commander our of main base. But the commander already has things to do outside of main base. They can go on the battlefield and recon/laze, they can build backup fobs, something that has greatly benefited my team many times.
If you aren’t seeing commanders leave main base, that’s at least partially because there is still a lot they can do even when the UAV is refueling. They can check in on squads, make sure flags are being defended and fobs are being built and push and prod SL’s to build them, ensure the intel markers are up to date, listen to comms for relevant intel to mark on map, and respond to requests for intel that other SL’s are too busy to respond to. The process of marking things as a squad lead is often somewhat complicated and difficult to do in the heat of battle. Having a commander greatly simplifies things and provides a great boon for squad leaders.

I find any of these strategies to be generally engaging and fun, and I have never thought that the commander role was “dead.” Many find commander boring and difficult, and that is their prerogative, but it doesn’t justify making the commander role more arcade-like with things like supply drops, frequent area attacks, and lower asset spawn times. I find flying difficult and boring, but that doesn’t justify making flying easier and more arcade-like.

It is true that, as a matter of technicality, squad leaders are not forced or strongly incentivized to follow commander guidance or orders. But the same is true of members of a squad. If a squad leader is confusing, incompetent or overly harsh, his squad will fragment, and they will refuse to follow his orders. Squad members only follow the SL in so far as they believe he is competent and they have something to gain from his guidance. The same is true for the relationship between a commander and squad leaders.

While its harder for a commander to manage squad leasers and easier for squad leaders to manage their squad members, if a commander communicates clearly, provides relevant and salient intel(a task greatly aided by the UAV), and shows good guidance and makes good suggestions for squads, they will tend to follow this advice, and the team will be better for the coordination.

I am not often skilled enough in my communication or intelligence gathering to gather this level of confidence from squad leaders, but it has happened. And when it doesn’t happen, and SL’s ignore my suggestions, request, or commands, that’s a problem with me and my style of communication and commanding, not a problem with the commander role. This last bit is, in my opinion, one of the main reasons why people want the command role changed to offer more tangible benefits like less respawn times and on-demand free-of-risk supply drops. Commanding, (and I mean actually commanding and guiding the team, not merely intel gathering), is difficult. But just because something is difficult doesn’t mean it should be changed.

If there were any changes to the commander role I would suggest, it would be to remove the requirement to have an officer kit to mark things on map and use the UAV. I imagine the change to require and officer kit was made to encourage dedicated commanders and discourage someone from leaving their squad, going commander for 1 minute, accepting an area attack, and then rejoining the squad. If this was the case, this can be more adequately prevented by simply increasing the “warm up” an area attack has from 1 minute to 5 minutes when a new commander is accepts the role. This still encourages dedicated commanders, and isn’t a complete nuisance for commanders trying to build back up fobs.

"If it sounds stupid but it works, it ain't stupid"-Murphy's law
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