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Old 2013-08-09, 04:56   #1
40mmrain
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Default Flares, UAV, lack of AT, asset rolling

All CAS vehicles have been given more flares, and the effectiveness has been buffed significantly as stated in the patch notes. It's quite obvious in game. Anti air missiles short of the most powerful and numerous ones never have an effect on the target when flares are in the air. This compounds with the lack of AT available and the super buffed UAV.

Because the UAV is uncounterable, moves position nearly instantly and never has to refuel, CAS has already received a massive buff because they only benefit from it, and they benefit the most overall. Because air interdiction, and CAS is the greatest counter to armour, decreased anti tank availability means that if your CAS is dominating, so is your armour, which leads to massive steamrolls. Ground attackers also spawn earlier, meaning that there is less time to set up air defense, another buff. Finally, the asset counts overall haven't really increased, therefore, the number of infantry per side has increased, and because AA and heavy anti tank have not increased in availability, or just decreased overall, more infantry are simply helpless.

The overall effect is helpless infantry and games won in the sky too often. Ive been on the giving end of these rolls and it's a bit boring when the enemy can barely put up a fight, and it feels cheap being able to bomb the crap out of the enemy without any fear.

CAS helicopters were slowed down and their missiles were reduced in effectiveness quite a bit, however jets are just as good as they ever were, just now with much better flares, and they certainly were never ineffective. Now they are too strong. pls nerf flares at least somewhat. Pls nerf UAv.
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Old 2013-08-09, 14:28   #2
Prevtzer
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Default Re: Flares, UAV, lack of AT, asset rolling

Agreed, flares are too effective and there are way too many of them. That + infinite UAV gives CAS huge advantage.
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Old 2013-08-09, 17:07   #3
Felix

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Default Re: Flares, UAV, lack of AT, asset rolling

UAV can easily be countered with another UAV either by lasing for their own jets or by counter lasing...

Twig life
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Old 2013-08-09, 23:06   #4
40mmrain
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Default Re: Flares, UAV, lack of AT, asset rolling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix View Post
UAV can easily be countered with another UAV either by lasing for their own jets or by counter lasing...
not really, counter lazing is a last resort that wont fool the best gunners. Even a skilled fighter pilot can understand precisely where his target is and attempt to attack the correct laze. Against fighter bombers, gunships and ground attack jets, counter lazing wont help that much. Only against the strike fighters can it help, but even then youre rolling the dice because all he'll do is go in on a run, see a laze, wait for lock, then bombs away, and certainly it might go on target. Further still, not all CAS vehicles need lazes anyways, simply the intel provided by the uav is invaluable for a gunship.

Another tactic ive noticed that I find cheap is putting the uav right next to the enemy's base. This allows the commander to laze vehicles just as they leave the main base, and lets him tell the pilots exactly when the enemy CAS is taking off, and what direction theyre going allowing pilots to easily get behind the enemy as they take off.

UAVs shouldnt really be allowed to be so close to the enemy base. I just don't find it realistic or fun for teams when entire games are won in the sky, and you can't get out of base without being seen or bombed.
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Last edited by 40mmrain; 2013-08-09 at 23:15..
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Old 2013-08-19, 17:15   #5
Skitrel

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Default Re: Flares, UAV, lack of AT, asset rolling

Quote:
Originally Posted by 40mmrain View Post
not really, counter lazing is a last resort that wont fool the best gunners. Even a skilled fighter pilot can understand precisely where his target is and attempt to attack the correct laze. Against fighter bombers, gunships and ground attack jets, counter lazing wont help that much. Only against the strike fighters can it help, but even then youre rolling the dice because all he'll do is go in on a run, see a laze, wait for lock, then bombs away, and certainly it might go on target. Further still, not all CAS vehicles need lazes anyways, simply the intel provided by the uav is invaluable for a gunship.

Another tactic ive noticed that I find cheap is putting the uav right next to the enemy's base. This allows the commander to laze vehicles just as they leave the main base, and lets him tell the pilots exactly when the enemy CAS is taking off, and what direction theyre going allowing pilots to easily get behind the enemy as they take off.

UAVs shouldnt really be allowed to be so close to the enemy base. I just don't find it realistic or fun for teams when entire games are won in the sky, and you can't get out of base without being seen or bombed.
This is completely correct.

The issue is indeed that when CAS dominates armour also dominates, leading to unfun games where infantry have almost no means of countering.

The solution to this is either some sort of nerf to the UAVs ability to lase targets, or improving infantry's ability to counter armour.

Personally I'd prefer to see the UAV lose the lase altogether, the problem with it is that armour has absolutely no ability to defend themselves against it, other than taking an AAV along with them. Even then though the quality pilots seem to have little issue with the AAVs, either taking them down first or simply successfully avoiding anti air attacks with good piloting and a lot of experience.

Tanks have nowhere to hide from an enemy UAV, whereas they can hide from enemy squad leader lases, which pin down a tank's position or force the tank to work with infantry.

Things have been tipped too far in favour of air and tanks, leaving infantry out in the cold if the enemy team has merely 5 or 6 players that know what they're doing, commander, CAS and 1 good enemy tank is all it can take to win a game.

Either removing the UAV lase, nerfing the UAV's mobility, or giving infantry another HAT would rebalance this situation. I honestly believe that 2 HATs in the infantry would tip the balance here enough to fix the problem. Too often does the situation arise where 49 players are reliant on that ONE guy with the HAT kit to successfully destroy a tank because the enemy team has completely dominated your armour. With 2 HATs tanks would have to maintain a distanced supporting role while infantry move in to remove embedded infantry, right now tanks make sure there's no HAT in the area and then steamrole right into the middle of bases knowing they're perfectly safe and infantry can do nothing at all except hide, die, or run for the hills while getting shot in the back.

The argument that infantry should build more TOWs doesn't work, commander spots the TOWs and has CAS eliminate them, your fob, your anti air, etc.

The game works amazingly when games are balanced, the right 5 people on a team should not be able to unbalance games so massively. Giving a HAT back would effectively force the armour dominating team into relying on infantry to get a flag capped rather than rolling in. This means those 5 people would have their power diminished and heighten the need for teamwork. A coordinated team could still defend against them as it would force infantry to move in rather than armour.

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Old 2013-08-09, 23:15   #6
PLODDITHANLEY
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Default Re: Flares, UAV, lack of AT, asset rolling

Haven't seen that but if possible DOD should apply to UAV too.
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Old 2013-08-09, 23:22   #7
40mmrain
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Default Re: Flares, UAV, lack of AT, asset rolling

Irrespective of DoDs, the UAv can still see the main bases, or at least close to them on larger draw distance maps. Of course silent eagle's bases have no dome of death, so the problem would persist there.
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Old 2013-08-10, 16:50   #8
Tarranauha200

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Default Re: Flares, UAV, lack of AT, asset rolling

The UAV is not realistic at all. AA should be able to take it down easily.
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Old 2013-08-10, 20:15   #9
Mora

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Default Re: Flares, UAV, lack of AT, asset rolling

I don't really see what the problem is. Ive yet to see CAS dominate. I think the buff was good.

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Old 2013-08-10, 21:14   #10
Stemplus

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Default Re: Flares, UAV, lack of AT, asset rolling

It's all about the skill. I personally didn't have any problem taking enemy CAS out, helis are now slow so it's as easy to shoot one down as it is to hit a moving tank. Jets are even easier to kill especially with the new flares, they get killed almost every time.

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