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Old 2012-02-06, 17:36   #31
hiberNative

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Default Re: Kalashnikov AK-12 Unveiled

Quote:
Originally Posted by pr|Zer0 View Post
same magazine insert system(M16/M4 magazine insert is waaay much better and waaaay less proned to error)
gogo picking up facts from thin air? because it's actually the other way around. the ar-feed system has its mechanism internal, while the ak system is external. naturally, this makes problem solving easier if something goes wrong or gets jammed by gravel/debris. that being said, the ar-platform is faster, speed-wise.
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side folding stock is gonna make someone upset, especially if is right-handed(whats the point of folding stock anyway - can fire from the hip more accurately??) same thing can be achieved by down-folding or telescopic, and the question was about side folding related to telescopic/down-folding. Its preferable to have a weapon ready then to find yourself unable to unlock or cock the weapon due to bad design
have you examined the properties of the left-side folding ak stock? because it sets in like a fixed stock, with zero travel. this doesn't only make it stable, it's insanely durable for hitting anything you could imagine doing with a fixed stock. i would never hit things with a telescopic stock.
furthermore, this stock (like the ak74m) folds to the left, leaving the weapon fully combat operational while folded. since the swallow mount system is no longer present, the stock can be tucked firmly against the receiver with optics mounted.
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Also, a bolt catch would have been great.
we haven't seen it being operated to its full extent yet, but i know romanian aks sometimes lock the bolt back upon the last round. hopefully the ak-12 has that feature.
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Ambidextrous charging handle is just useless when you have to use the right hand to insert a new magazine.
i didn't really understand that but a right handed shooter preferably loads a magazine and pulls the charging handle with his left hand.

it's an old system, sure, but so is the 1911 design, and both are still excellent weapons for modern applications, if applied properly.

if you don't trust old russian footage of russians using aks, i really recommend travis haley's "adaptive kalash". really informative and well thought through dvd about the system as a whole.

[YOUTUBEHD]JfGnz38K9ik[/YOUTUBEHD]

[YOUTUBEHD]tA_JeI3gBGM[/YOUTUBEHD]

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Last edited by hiberNative; 2012-02-06 at 17:48..
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Old 2012-02-06, 22:33   #32
Bob_Marley
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Default Re: Kalashnikov AK-12 Unveiled

Now I may be talking out of my arse, but that stock looks like a combined telescopic/folder ala the G36KV to me. As for swithching to an AR-style magazine insertion method that was never going to happen, they'd have to replace all the magazines currently in inventory and the new magazines wouldn't be backward compatible with the weapons currently in service (which is also a concern for export).

Interesting to see the top mounted rail, I'd always believed that the russian side mount system was because of slop in the top cover's tolerances messing up the zero. Then again they've moved the rear sight to the rear of the top cover, so I guess they're confident they sorted that problem (if it actually existed and I didn't imagine it) out, which is nice as is the longer sight radius. Definetly a good idea with that ambi charging handle though, the AK's right side only is noted for being awkward for righties. As well as all that they've finally got rid of that stubby pistol grip and even put on something that looks like a thumb selector/safety.

All in all excellent to see a modernization programme that deals with some long standing issues rather than (or in addition to) simply adding more M1913 rails.

The key to modernising any weapon is covering them in glue and tossing them in a barrel of M1913 rails until they look "Modern" enough.

Many thanks to [R-DEV]Adriaan for the sig!
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Old 2012-02-06, 22:36   #33
Stealthgato

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Default Re: Kalashnikov AK-12 Unveiled

Quote:
Originally Posted by hiberNative
[YOUTUBEHD]tA_JeI3gBGM[/YOUTUBEHD]
Pushing out a magazine with another magazine = maximum swag reload.

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Old 2012-02-06, 23:55   #34
YankeeSamurai
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Default Re: Kalashnikov AK-12 Unveiled

I believe Mod Bob Marley's signature is relevant here xD

I'm not knowledgable enough about the technical side of firearms to contribute anything new/constructive in that area...

But all of you who are complaining about the "unsexy" look of the rifle- just install some optics and new furniture and I'm sure it'll look great.
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Old 2012-02-08, 00:14   #35
ShockUnitBlack

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Default Re: Kalashnikov AK-12 Unveiled

I can't see the Russians replacing their AK-74Ms for a few years yet.

"I Want To Spend The Rest Of My Life With You Tonight."
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Old 2012-02-08, 00:33   #36
Gotrol

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Default Re: Kalashnikov AK-12 Unveiled

I am still waiting for AEK type system to be implemented. At least to the units that don't have their hands in their asses anyways.
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Old 2012-02-08, 13:36   #37
samogon100500

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Default Re: Kalashnikov AK-12 Unveiled

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Originally Posted by Gotrol View Post
I am still waiting for AEK type system to be implemented. At least to the units that don't have their hands in their asses anyways.
Well prototype AEK was very very good.1500 rounds per minute(Also 800-900 for modern one not bad anyway),almost no recoil by balanced automatic(Something same on AK-107).Also it's good gun for special forces,not for army,if update it to level of AK-12.
Also AK-12 simpler - better weapon for army.

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Old 2012-02-09, 11:13   #38
Gotrol

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Default Re: Kalashnikov AK-12 Unveiled

It is interesting to see how AK-12 is now, visually, looks much more like the AEK series. Perhaps some engineering solutions were implemented as well.

Updating AEK to the level of AK-12 can be done in a very limited time, since ergonomically, AEK is a much more successful project than the AK series. The level of complexity on the AEK versus the AK series is also an argument that can be viewed skeptically. What about the transition from Mossin to PPSh or AK series? I would imagine reliability is the key factor that keeps AEK from bettering the AK completely.
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Old 2012-02-09, 14:54   #39
jerkzilla

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Default Re: Kalashnikov AK-12 Unveiled

When I read the first post a couple of weeks ago, I actually though they managed to make the gun disassemble into an upper and a lower receiver, like the AR15 and SIG550 series. Then I read Bob's post and subsequently, the original post and I was all

Still, it's probably a massive improvement to the versatility of it if their current solution works as advertised. Somebody here, possibly a member of the FDF, once said about the RK95 or 62 that the dust cover doesn't really fit back in exactly as it was so re-zeroing the rifle might be necessary, but then again, I heard this at least a few years ago and it's just anecdotal.

This signature is here due to lack of imagination.
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Old 2012-04-30, 11:26   #40
PLODDITHANLEY
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Default Re: Kalashnikov AK-12 Unveiled

Blogpost - any Russki's confirm this?


Quote:
I was following this story in the Russian media and here?s the results: Russian defence ministry is NOT interested in buying this weapon, it?s got the same internal parts as AK 74′s they got surplus of 17 million with only 1 million army forces. This gun will be offered to the foreign sales.
I watch lot of russian forces using AK?s and non of them got optics exept of SVD or Vintorez. They simply can?t afford mounting optics on every weapon. Izshmash factory is a bancrupt, they designed thei AK-12 hoping for new sales but the factory still filed for bancruptcy. Russian defense department wants a completely new rifle, not modified AK-74. Sorry guys, but it?s real life.
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