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Valleyforge3946
2011-06-26, 03:29
Okay so i have been meaning to make this thread for a while now. I haven't because i ran out of moneys to pay for internets. 0.0 And now here i am at Mcdonalds writing this to all of you amazing guys of the PR Community. This will be kind of long and for those of you with Dyslyexia and or AD/HD (like me :3) Then i suggest you grab a drink or a notepad and try to keep up. This will be a General feedback of just about everything vehicle related by country.

HAMAS- what vehicles?! Lol

IDF- Merkava Tank- I love this tank but i think that some work needs to be checked on its RPG capabilities. Because right now, thats the weakest part of the vehicle. i'd say its balanced with the other tanks top armor. The Merkava has been designed from the ground up for urban warfare, it has taken RPG hits before(with a few losses i admit) and is usually fine. Was this left like this on purpose or is it currently considering revision? In game version is MK 4 right?

Namer APC works great but on Beirut, it comes to a stand down between Namer and Btr-80 all the time and neither can damage each other. Its really Annoying and does need to be fixed. Suggest 1 btr with a 2A72? gun with a 10-15 minute respawn time.

Humvee's- same prob as american humvee. Bullets just dont go through it at all. But i know Cheeseman has been working on his up-armoured humvees so heres hoping.

Great Britain- Challenger II- Great Tank, however once tracked it has a serious bunny hopping issue. Pretty sure it is known so ignore this. :)

Warrior IFV- Same issue as Challenger II from Time to Time.

Russia-
BRDM2- Easy to flip over but not a problem if you have some experience under your belt.
14.5mm KPVT kinda strong still isn't it? Seeing that it still tears up the Lav-25 which the latest version is supposedly proofed against. LAV-25 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LAV-25#LAV-25A2)

T-90 Nothing really wrong with it, but the 1 shot kills to leopards on Silent Eagle is VERY annoying. It's hunting chickens in a chicken coop.

BMP-3 <3 This thing but... it does remind me of a bouncy boat sometimes. Add some top weight maybe? i know its not hard to do. (me & 3 others have been in the process of making a mini-mod for a while now, but since i have no internet and he has summer college and the other 2 want to quit.. not going so well)

Canada-
Leopard 2- Needs stronger Glacis Plate.

Lav-III i like it better than the Lav-25 but, tbh it is top heavy. Even us experienced drivers have difficulty with it. if it leans even a little too much, your doomed. (Evil Yamilia trenches and weird choppy terrain of Operation Archer.)

Taliban and Rebels
Technical
This thing needs some work. This thread shows part of the reason. https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f18-pr-bf2-suggestions/96679-increase-technical-50-deviation.html

Bomb Car- Slightly less effective maybe? i can see gary killing a tank. (i've seen some photos of HUGE car bombs, looked like somebody dropped a 500 pounder in the middle of the damn street.) But the bomb car? There is 1 pack of c4 in the car as far as i can tell. Maybe add a few more packs? *note* Visual only.

USMC-
M1A2 Abrahms-
Is it just me or is the newly modeled M1a2 abrams tanks textured at a lower resolution than the previous ones? Also, tanks now seem very.... balanced. even taking a look at the individual .com and .tweak files, they are very similar in coding. The T-72 feels stronger than the M1A2. Also, Why does the HUD for the show the main armament as APFSDS-T(Tungsten) when we americans have been using DU rounds since the first gulf war and continue to use today. i know we still do. What a Strange Way to Protect Civilians: Depleted Uranium and Libya (http://www.newsfrommiddleeast.com/?xstart=b&new=76892)
There are plenty of article from BBC and other new groups complaining about Americas use of DU rounds. So much so that Britain stopped using DU rounds and switched to Tungsten. Just saying. Not insulting british chaps. We have you to thank for this glorious mod. :3

Stryker- Occasional graphical glitches when looking at it from certain angles and distances the turrent is hovering above the vehicle.

Lav-25 Still Damaged from 14.5mm KPVT.

Humvee- Same problem as IDF.

Avenger Humvee- Nothing afaik. :)

Bradley- Decent Armor. i thought it what 25mm proof? Anyways, Tow launcher on that thing is barbaric. Why is it so different from every other Tow launcher in game? what is the point honestly? Missile fight between BMP3 9m117 > BGM-71 Tow on Bradley. Just saying. Its also seeming slower than any other missile as well.

China- Hardly play any maps with them.

MEC- T-72 too strong maybe? its user freference. Definitely easier to aim that the abrams.

Germany- Leopard 2- same as canada

Sch?tzenpanzer Puma- My lawnmower could handle tougher terrain and the missile launcher? STUPID. Why is it the only one that you have to stop and face your enemy directly with the turret because it wont turn?
Random stuff i want to infrom and inquire about.


For those of you using Windows 7 or Vista.. if your connecting to a server you load in and your screen flashes black for a second.. lags and then continues as normal. Thats PR eating a LOT your available memory and Aero shutting itself off. Intentional? idk.

I am going in grey area here. The RPG-7 is either too weak or 2 strong according to which side you prefer. i say that the problem is not the weapon itself but the warheads that are being used. Anyway to have mixed warhead types? left click fragmentation with a limited number of heat warheads right click? just a question.

Is the RPG-29 going to be introduced to Russia as Heavy AT? i mean.. i know its classified as a light AT weapon but its effectivness has proved its at least on par with the Kornet missile system. Its been confirmed to have penetrated Merkava Mk4, Challenger II and even the Abrams tank on the glacis plate.

Lastly, do the devs ever plan on improving the current ricochet and penetration system? For those of you who have played FH2 you will notice that rounds actually bounce off of tanks with stronger armor than the type of round you are firing and that when you score a kill a *bullethole* like effect appears on the static wreak. i'd like to see something similar in PR. Currently FH2 achieves this ricochet and penetration system by utilizing Python. Don't believe me just look at the mod files.

For Those of you complaining about 3 round burst on the M4. Amazingly, its just like that in real life. Just aim center mass. at best 2 will hit and 1 is going off randomly. If need be, 3 round bust hipfire. When clearing a building, it works just about the same. He's 10 feet away for gods sake.

Lastly, i know that PR is currently able to "track" vehicles and it is a nice feature. But can it be expanded further? i only know basic Python, how to tweak files in bf2 and setting values. Nothing visual, and limited gamecoding so if someone could elaborate in detail that'd help. Just imagine Damaged engine, decreased gun effectiveness, sights broken. What exactly are the limits of the the Refractor 2 engine. For those of you who look at my join date. i was playing PR for almost 2 years by the time i joined. This mod got me modding. So anything i can do for the community count me in.

dtacs
2011-06-26, 07:45
Firstly, when giving feedback you should put it in the respective area (https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f254-v0-95-vehicles), and if possible, deliberate on it a bit more so its not all over the place. Divide your vehicle-specific feedback into factions, as opposed to having points on the LAV-25 (for example) in different places. Are you suggesting vehicle stats be changed or simply giving feedback on the effectiveness of the vehicles?
Is the RPG-29 going to be introduced to Russia as Heavy AT? i mean.. i know its classified as a light AT weapon but its effectivness has proved its at least on par with the Kornet missile system. Its been confirmed to have penetrated Merkava Mk4, Challenger II and even the Abrams tank on the glacis plate.As for points like this, the Russian MA can shed light on it. If it isn't in game, there is a reason for it.

Ensure you check out the Updates area, the BMP-2 for example is being added to Beirut, a healthy balance to the Namer.

Sch?tzenpanzer Puma- My lawnmower could handle tougher terrain and the missile launcher? STUPID. Why is it the only one that you have to stop and face your enemy directly with the turret because it wont turn?
Random stuff i want to infrom and inquire about.
[R-DEV]Jaymmz confined that the Puma is being given Namer-like characteristics next patch. Its in my understanding that it may even be removed from Lashkar as its unfit for the map. The TOW issue is being fixed as well.

If you would have done your research, you would've seen that many vehicles such as the Spandrel, Bradley and Puma cannot fire their wire-guided missiles on the move, meaning they have to stop for a time (max 30 seconds) in order to use them.

Nixy23
2011-06-26, 10:04
The Bradley is really not 25mm proof. I've ripped one up on Quai River when driving in a VN-3 scout vehicle (with 14.5mm gun). 1 full clip (50 rounds) on the backside was enough to get it burning.

J.F.Leusch69
2011-06-26, 13:50
moved to vehicle feedback section

TheComedian
2011-06-26, 15:11
MEC and Russia have the same T-90 tank. Militia have T-72.

You are comparing BRDM vs LAV25 but there is no map that features both together.

What specific problem does the humvee have? It has bulletproof windows.

BMP-3 has psychological warfare cannon.

Wakain
2011-06-26, 15:33
hey dtacs, I thought I was quite up to date, but apparently I've missed lot of information, could you shed some light as to where you've heard this all?

Eddie Baker
2011-06-26, 15:48
In APFSDS-T, the 'T' stands for "Tracer," not Tungsten (you'll see the "-T" on other HUDs next to "HEI" and others). The penetrator in the M829 series of rounds is still made of DU.

You are comparing BRDM vs LAV25 but there is no map that features both together.

No, he was talking about the KPVT heavy machine-gun on the BRDM-2, which is also on several other vehicles in game (VN-3 and BTR-60 series come to mind).

maniac1031
2011-06-26, 15:57
MEC and Russia have the same T-90 tank. Militia have T-72.


What specific problem does the humvee have? It has bulletproof windows.



1 The MEC use the 72 and Russia uses the 90. The MEC one doesn't have a tow so its not a 90
Militia has a 55 I think which should not be able to stand up to the challenger on dragon fly. And a 72 should not be able to go toe to toe with an abrams.

2 Idf humvee is open and you cant shoot people out of it I think

Nixy23
2011-06-26, 17:19
It's a 62 on the militia's side I think.

It shouldn't stand up to the Chally indeed, but it has a fair chance if the Chally crew messes up.

ShockUnitBlack
2011-06-26, 17:33
Russia uses the T-90, the MEC the T-72, and the Militia the T-62.

Rudd
2011-06-26, 17:38
Lastly, do the devs ever plan on improving the current ricochet and penetration system? For those of you who have played FH2 you will notice that rounds actually bounce off of tanks with stronger armor than the type of round you are firing and that when you score a kill a *bullethole* like effect appears on the static wreak. i'd like to see something similar in PR. Currently FH2 achieves this ricochet and penetration system by utilizing Python. Don't believe me just look at the mod files.

FH2 does indeed do this very well

thanks for the feedback

Hotrod525
2011-06-27, 22:01
Ok, so except WikiPedia, what do you know about Armor ?

LAV25A2 will sustain a 14.5mm hit, the only sad thing is : that we have the LAV25 in game, not the A2 variant.

M113, LAV25, LAV3, BTR-6/8/9o's, BRDM, VN3, all civilian car, all softskin military veh. ( i mean HMMWV/Log/Etc ), should not even sustain a single hit of APFSDS-T. Actually anything below 30 tons should be extremely damaged (if not destroyed) by a single burst of 25mm. Only some IFV [Ex: Puma] are a real last generation (or have been upgraded to [Ex:M2A3]) IFV... Everything else should be alot weaker. Most IFV currently use around the world where design in the 80's, they are old, have seen only few upgrades ( for those lucky that actuly got upgraded. ) and/or [Ex:VN3, Panhard] are design to sustain 7.62MM/ATRY SHRAPNEL nothing less, nothing more. Main Battle Tank, like M1A2, L2A6M, CR2, T80U/90, would sustain praticly anything you have to trow at them. M1 Abrams prove it in 90's, the last gen of MBT, are by far the most deadliest thing, you will ever encounter on the ground. T62 and T72 standed no chance at all against them they where not even capable to fire back (lack of range)... Afghanistan proved the weakness and the strongest of vehicle encountering mine/ied all the time... wich lead us to an other point, its not cause a RG-31 can sustain a 2x 155mm arty shell IED blast, that mean it will stand a chance against a 12,7mm API MG.

So in the end what ? R-Dev go for "All Realism" ? So you will be able to kill nearly all APC with a single .50 box ? Unable to fire at you're enemy (acheived with incredible deviation ] ? Making some MBT litteraly invincible against some other ? May be not... But yeah Armor values of some vehicle might need a review, but ever been in a Merkava on the receiving end of an RPG-7 ? I honestly doubt...

splatters
2011-06-27, 22:36
Small arms projectiles ricochet in PR, we can apply this to larger caliber projectiles too with different values I'd suppose.

Would really improve the damage modelling of PR.

Stoickk
2011-06-28, 14:07
I can tell you with absolute certainty that the Bradley is not 25mm proof. When I was enlisted, we had a training accident on a live fire range. One Bradley fired on another Bradley with live training ammunition. Four rounds impacted on the right side between the middle and rear of the vehicle. The training ammunition, which uses inert tracer projectiles, still tore 1/2 to 3/4 inch deep craters into the armor. These were not depleted uranium projectiles or any other type of combat ammunition. After seeing that first hand, I did not have nearly as much faith in the armor plating on that big metal box.

Mikemonster
2011-06-28, 18:58
One upside is that at least you knew the gun was effective.. ;)

Hotrod525
2011-06-28, 23:04
I can tell you with absolute certainty that the Bradley is not 25mm proof. When I was enlisted, we had a training accident on a live fire range. One Bradley fired on another Bradley with live training ammunition. Four rounds impacted on the right side between the middle and rear of the vehicle. The training ammunition, which uses inert tracer projectiles, still tore 1/2 to 3/4 inch deep craters into the armor. These were not depleted uranium projectiles or any other type of combat ammunition. After seeing that first hand, I did not have nearly as much faith in the armor plating on that big metal box.

Oh and you forgot to said, the BLUE 25mm round... have only a fraction of the propeling charge you will got in a Combat ( non-training ) round. But still i'm suprise the M2 havent been breach, did it hit in a angle ?

mp50967
2011-06-29, 00:45
you forgot the AAVP7 under usmc and they stryker and bradly are Army not usmc.. and the scimitar is missing for BAF

Rudd
2011-06-29, 00:56
you forgot the AAVP7 under usmc and they stryker and bradly are Army not usmc.. and the scimitar is missing for BAF

what on earth are you going on about?

1) the scimitar is ingame

2) the USMC use the AAV7PA1 ingame, and the USA use the strkyer and bradley, the exception being Fallujah since the US Army were involved in that battle IRL.

dtacs
2011-06-29, 07:49
hey dtacs, I thought I was quite up to date, but apparently I've missed lot of information, could you shed some light as to where you've heard this all?
Puma-related stuff I got from Jaymz in an Xfire discussion after asking why it was so horrible at climbing even the slightest of hills, and why its generally an inneffective vehicle. The TOW issue was recognized by the team after a bug report by Bufl4x and will presumably be fixed since the game is not fit for release with the bug present.

The BMP-2 on Beirut can be seen in the BMP-2 thread, check the highlights/Dev blog sections.

TheComedian
2011-06-30, 12:04
The BMP-2 on Beirut can be seen in the BMP-2 thread, check the highlights/Dev blog sections.

I can't find any thread related to BMP. That, or the search engine is broken.

Doc.Pock
2011-07-02, 07:57
the other comedian