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View Full Version : Weapon New RPG-7 Series Warheads in v1.3.5


Rhino
2015-10-27, 19:01
This has been very overdue for PR but finally in v1.3.5 we now have a lot more verity of RPG-7 Warheads to play with!

https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/v1-3-5_RPG7_Warheads_tn.jpg (https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/v1-3-5_RPG7_Warheads.jpg)
(Click to Enlarge)

Before I begin I would like to note that not all the warheads I showed in the Guess the RPG-7 Warheads Blog (https://www.realitymod.com/forum/blogs/2363/b429-guess-rpg-7-warheads.html) are in v1.3.5 and as such, are not featured here. They will be coming in a later PR release and we will be posting information about them then. But for now we will just be talking about the RPG-7 Warheads being featured in v1.3.5 :)


Warhead Weight Classes

In PR v1.3.5 we now have three weight classes for our RPG-7 Warheads; Light, Medium and Heavy. When it comes to aiming these different types of warhead with iron sights the ranging will be done automatically for each warheads weight with the ranging menu BUT, when aiming with the PGO-7 optical sight on the RPG-7V2, you will need to know which weight class your warhead is in order to range it properly with the sights reticle.

https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/RPG-7V2_Reticle_tn.jpg (https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/RPG-7V2_Reticle.jpg)
(Click to Enlarge)

Many of you should already be familiar with this reticle from previous releases but now with more than just two types of RPG-7 Warheads in PR v1.3.5 you will now have to use all the different ranging marks for different types of warhead. The left side ranges being for the Light Warheads like the PG-7V and PG-7VM, the right side ranges for Medium Warheads like the PG-7VL and the SAKR Cobrra, and finally the bottom middle ranges for the Heavy Warheads like the PG-7VR Tandem and eventually the TBG-7V Thermobaric and DZGI-40 Airburst rounds (which are not featured in v1.3.5). The weights of each warhead will be stated below with each round but if you forget, just look at the size of the warhead and judge it against any you already know and you can probably guess pretty accurately what weight class it comes in.


Warhead Types

In v1.3.5 we only have two types of RPG-7 Warhead which are High-Explosive Anti-Tank (HEAT) and Tandem HEAT Warheads. They are both designed to penetrate though armour but Tandem HEAT is designed to be more effective against reactive armour, found on most modern day tanks, by having two warheads packed in to one rocket. The first stage of the weapon is typically a weak charge that either pierces the reactive armour of the target without detonating it leaving a channel through the reactive armour so that the second warhead may pass unimpeded, or simply detonating the armourplate causing the timing of the counter-explosion to fail. The second detonation from the same projectile (which defines it as a tandem charge) attacks the same location as the first detonation where the reactive armour has been compromised. Since the regular armour plating is often the only defence remaining, the main charge (second detonation) has an increased likelihood of penetrating the armour.

While standard HEAT rounds can still do a lot of damage to a tank, your going to need a few of them to be able to destroy it.

While there may only be two types of RPG-7 warheads in v1.3.5, each round is still unique with different sizes of warhead with different penetration levels for each so be sure to study the stats so you know what your shooting.


RPG-7 Series Warheads

PG-7V HEAT
This was the original RPG-7 Warhead produced by the Soviet Union and provided to North Vietnam starting in 1966, with eventually being carried by every infantry squad in the People's Army of Vietnam (PAVN). Although it saw its initial combat in the 1967 Arab-Israeli War, the RPG-7 gained its vaunted international reputation in Vietnam. The rocket first came to the American public's notice during the 1968 Tet Offensive, where it was employed to deadly effect in the fighting in and around Hue. More accurate, longer-ranged, easier to use and far more powerful than the RPG-2 that it replaced and even more powerful than the much heavier 57mm recoilless rifles North Vietnam had received from China and the Soviet Union in the 1950s, it proved to be an equalizer in infantry vs tank combat.
This warhead is no longer produced in Russia but copies of it are still being used and produced all over the world to this day.
https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/PG-7V_tn.jpg (https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/PG-7V.jpg)
(Click to Enlarge)
Date Created: 1961
Countries of Origin: USSR/Russia
Diameter: 85mm
Length: 899mm
Weight: 2.25kg - Light
Armour Penetration: 260mm RHA
Effective Range: 330m

Factions & Kits using this warhead:
ARF: Rifleman AT Alternative (x3)
Militia: Rifleman AT Alternative (x2)
Taliban: Rifleman AT Alternative (x3)
HAMAS: Rifleman AT Alternative (x3)
FSA: Rifleman AT Alternative (x3)
NVA: Rifleman AT (x2)
NVA: Rifleman AT Alternative (x2)
NVA: Heavy-AT (x4)


PG-7VM HEAT
After the RPG-7 rocket launcher and the PG-7V round were fielded in 1961, the Bazalt State Research and Production Enterprise continued improving them. As a result, in 1969 the PG-7V round was replaced with the upgraded PG-7VM, designed by V. I. Medvedev.
A more advanced shaped-charge warhead taken from the PG-9 round, fired by the SPG-9 recoilless gun, improved expelling charge and rocket motor, as well as a reduced weight of the round from 2.2kg of the PG-7V to 2.0kg, have resulted in a significant increase in a number of its characteristics. For instance, despite a reduction in the calibre from 85mm to 70mm. its armour penetration increased from 260mm to 300mm. Improved expelling charge and rocket motor have significantly reduced the side wind-caused cross-trail (1.5-fold). The accuracy of fire has also been improved by 20-25%. Overall the warhead was a big improvement over the old PG-7V and as such its still used and produced widely today.
https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/PG-7VM_tn.jpg (https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/PG-7VM.jpg)
(Click to Enlarge)
Date Created: 1969
Countries of Origin: USSR/Russia
Diameter: 70mm
Length: 925mm
Weight: 1.98kg - Light
Armour Penetration: 300mm RHA
Effective Range: 500m

Factions & Kits using this warhead:
ARF: Rifleman AT (x2)
Taliban: Rifleman AT (x2)
HAMAS: Rifleman AT (x2)
FSA: Rifleman AT (x2)
Insurgents: Rifleman AT (x2)


PG-7VS HEAT
In the early 1970s Russia needed to upgrade its RPG-7 rounds to counter the thicker armour of new western armoured vehicles. This consisted in considerably increasing the PG-7VM rounds armour penetration, while preserving its weight and dimensions. The work was done by Bazalt in cooperation with a number of special enterprises. V. P. Zaitsev and O. F. Dzyadukh were appointed leading designers.
Characteristics of the new round were improved through the use of more powerful warhead explosives, a brass shaped-charge cone, and a modified cone production technology. A reduction in the spin rate of the rocket along the trajectory decreased the dispersion of the shaped-charge jet, caused by the centrifugal force. Design and technology improvements increased armour penetration from 300mm to 400mm without increasing warhead dimensions. The new PG-7VS round for the RPG-7V rocket launcher entered the inventory in 1973. A PG-7VS1, fitted with cheaper warhead explosives and featuring an armour penetration of 360mm, was manufactured in the mid 1970s as well.
https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/PG-7VS_tn.jpg (https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/PG-7VS.jpg)
(Click to Enlarge)
Date Created: 1973
Countries of Origin: USSR/Russia
Diameter: 70mm
Length: 925mm
Weight: 1.98kg - Light
Armour Penetration: 360mm RHA
Effective Range: 500m

Factions & Kits using this warhead:
Russia: Rifleman AT Alternative (x2)


PG-7VL HEAT
Development of a new enhanced-penetration anti-tank round was a response to better armour protection of NATO main battle tanks (M1 Abrams and Leopard-2), expected in the late 1970s, through the use of multi-layered (composite) and spaced armour. The new round was based on the results of the research and development, conducted by Bazalt in the mid 1970s. Back then designers determined that the calibre and the warhead weight of a rocket could be increased at the expense of a slight reduction in the range of fire. It would increase armour penetration while preserving the design of the rocket launcher proper. The new round was designed under the supervision of V. M. Lenin.
The new round, designated PG-7VL ('L' stands for 'Luch' - the codename of the research and development project) was fielded in 1977. A larger calibre of 93mm and a heavier warhead increased armour penetration up to 500mm. A greater weight of the rocket reduced its muzzle velocity and the effective range of fire down to 300m, which had an impact on ensuring accurate fire from new rocket launchers, firing all types of rounds. The sight was also upgraded and designated PGO-7V1. Rocket launchers already in service were fitted with an instruction plate, mounted on the PGO-7V sight and sporting a conversion table for converting the tangent scale into the real range of fire of PG-7L rounds.
https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/PG-7VL_tn.jpg (https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/PG-7VL.jpg)
(Click to Enlarge)
Date Created: 1977
Countries of Origin: USSR/Russia
Diameter: 93mm
Length: 990mm
Weight: 2.6kg - Medium
Armour Penetration: 500mm RHA
Effective Range: 300m

Factions & Kits using this warhead:
Militia: Heavy-AT Alternative (x2)
Russia: Heavy-AT Alternative (x2)


Cobrra HEAT
The Cobrra is an Egyptian-manufactured unitary HEAT projectile. The Cobra was developed by the state-owned Arab Organization for Industrialization. The projectile weighs approximately 2.25kg, and is said to have an effective range of 300m. The main charge of the projectile is approximately 85mm in diameter and is stated of being capable of penetrating over 500mm of RHA.
In recent years this round has been seen quite a bit in Sryia with the FSA and other factions.
https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/Cobrra_tn.jpg (https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/Cobrra.jpg)
(Click to Enlarge)
Date Created: ~2005?
Countries of Origin: Egypt
Diameter: ~85mm
Length: ~985mm
Weight: 2.75kg - Medium
Armour Penetration: 500mm RHA
Effective Range: 300m

Factions & Kits using this warhead:
ARF: Heavy-AT Alternative (x2)
Taliban: Heavy-AT (x2)
Taliban: Heavy-AT Pickup (x2)
FSA: Heavy-AT Alternative (x2)


Iranian Tandem HEAT
Little is known about this projectile, and what OSINT is available seems to come primarily from Iranian sources. The tip of the warhead features a 30mm precursor charge that is integrated into the elongated nose probe, ahead of an 80mm main charge. The projectile weighs 2.5kg, is supposedly effective out to 300m, and is said to be able to penetrate 350mm of RHA after detonating though the reactive armour (ERA).
In recent years this warhead has been seen quite a bit in the Syrian conflict with the FSA and other factions.
https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/Iranian_Tandem_tn.jpg (https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/Iranian_Tandem.jpg)
(Click to Enlarge)
Date Created: N/A
Countries of Origin: Iran
Diameter: 30mm / 80mm
Length: ~1050mm
Weight: 2.5kg - Medium
Armour Penetration: ERA + 350mm RHA
Effective Range: 300m

Factions & Kits using this warhead:
ARF: Heavy-AT (x3)
Taliban: Heavy-AT Alternative (x3)
FSA: Heavy-AT (x3)


PG-7VR Tandem HEAT
In the early 1980s NATO countries started using add-on explosive reactive armour (ERA) to improve protection against shaped-charge ammunition. As a result, the efficiency of man-portable anti-tank rocket launchers, firing HEAT rounds, was drastically affected.
To counter this Russia produced the world's first Tandem HEAT warhead round for a rocket launcher which was developed by the Bazalt State Research and Production Enterprise (leading engineer A. B. Kulakovsky) and fielded with the USSR Armed Forces in 1988 under the designation of PG-7VR (R stands for 'Rezyume' - the codename of the research and development project) and is capable of defeating tanks equipped with add-on ERA.
The PG-7VR tandem warhead consists of two HEAT warheads - the first or precursor charge with a calibre of 64mm and the main warhead with a calibre of 105mm. The front warhead detonates explosives of the ERA. The main warhead, accommodated at a certain distance from the precursor charge, which ensures its safety during the explosion of the front warhead and ERA. detonates with a slight delay. This arrangement allows the rocket to penetrate 600mm of the core armour after defeating ERA. However, a considerably heavier round resulted in a reduction in the effective rage of fire down to 200m.
When the new round with totally different ballistics entered the inventory of the RPG-7V launcher, it became necessary to modify the sight (the new sight was designated PGO-7V3) and fit them to the rocket launchers, with a detachable folding bipod (just like on the older 'night' versions of the rocket launcher). The new PGO-7V3 optical sight has range scales for firing all types of rounds, including the TBG-7V Thermobaric round and the OG-7V Fragmentation round developed later on. The irons sights were modified as well. The new rocket launcher was designated RPG-7V1. while its airborne variant was designated RPG-7D2.
This warhead was seen in use with the Iraqi Insurgents during the 2003 Iraq war and on the 28th of August 2003, it achieved a mobility kill against an American M1 Abrams, hitting the left side hull next to the forward section of the engine compartment. It penetrated a fuel tank, flooding the compartment with fuel. In more recent years it has been seen in many other conflicts from the Gaza Strip, Libya, and most recently Syria.
https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/PG-7VR_tn.jpg (https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/PG-7VR.jpg)
(Click to Enlarge)
Date Created: 1988
Countries of Origin: USSR / Russia
Diameter: 64mm / 105mm
Length: 1250mm
Weight: 4.5kg - Heavy
Armour Penetration: ERA + 600mm RHA
Effective Range: 200m

Factions & Kits using this warhead:
ARF: Heavy-AT Alternative (x1)
Militia: Heavy-AT (x2)
Militia: Heavy-AT Alternative (x1)
Taliban: Heavy-AT (x1)
FSA: Heavy-AT Alternative (x1)
FSA: Heavy-AT Pickup (x2)
Russia: Heavy-AT (x2)
Russia: Heavy-AT Alternative (x1)


Fired Projectile Tail-boom and Thins

Another small update over the old RPG-7 warheads is that when fired ingame, the tail-boom will be exposed and the thins will be folded out, unlike the old RPG-7 rounds in PR which still had the "expelling charge" attached after being fired.
https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/PG-7VL_Projectile_tn.jpg (https://media.realitymod.com/highlights/RPG-7_Warheads_v1-3-5/PG-7VL_Projectile.jpg)
(Click to Enlarge)
While yes it will be hard to notice these thins being open in flight, ingame, but it will still make for awesome screenshots and the like :D



Cheers for reading and stay tuned for the installment of the other RPG-7 Warheads in a later release! :mrgreen:

Ason
2015-10-27, 19:09
Awesome! Nice work Rhino!:)

Arc_Shielder
2015-10-27, 19:15
Variety is the spice of life!

Scubbo
2015-10-27, 19:31
nice work, looking forward to the update!

mehason
2015-10-27, 19:56
And what splash effect will be?

Genitals
2015-10-27, 19:58
PG-7V HEAT
NVA: Heavy-AT (x4)

Are you replacing the M18 Recoilless Rifle for NVA with just a regular PG-7V? Since NVA HAT alt was not mentioned I'm going to assume it will stay in as the alt kit.

PG-7VM HEAT
Insurgents: Rifleman AT (x2)
Do insurgents get a Rifleman AT class now? Or is the ground spawned kits reduced from 3 rockets to 2 of these? Also, ARF get heavy AT now too?

Also:
PG-7VL HEAT
Russia: Heavy-AT Alternative (x2)

PG-7VR Tandem HEAT
Russia: Heavy-AT (x2)
Russia: Heavy-AT Alternative (x1)

???

And finally:
Taliban: Heavy-AT Pickup (x2)
What's Heavy-AT Pickup mean?

Definitely looking forward to the update. So many options to choose from.

Rhino
2015-10-27, 20:15
And what splash effect will be?

more or less the same as the old RPG-7 rounds. Since they are HEAT, shaped charge rounds all the energy is direct forwards, into w/e it hits, to try and penetrate though it, so not that much of the explosion goes outwards.

PG-7V HEAT
NVA: Heavy-AT (x4)

Are you replacing the M18 Recoilless Rifle for NVA with just a regular PG-7V? Since NVA HAT alt was not mentioned I'm going to assume it will stay in as the alt kit.

No, the Type 36 Recoilless Rifle (Chinese made M18) is still in the Alternative HAT for NVA, but in r/l it wasn't as powerful as the PG-7V.

PG-7VM HEAT
Insurgents: Rifleman AT (x2)
Do insurgents get a Rifleman AT class now? Or is the ground spawned kits reduced from 3 rockets to 2 of these? Also, ARF get heavy AT now too?

Ye its the pickup kit for the ME Insurgents from caches and I'm pretty sure ARF had a HAT kit before.

Also:
PG-7VL HEAT
Russia: Heavy-AT Alternative (x2)

PG-7VR Tandem HEAT
Russia: Heavy-AT (x2)
Russia: Heavy-AT Alternative (x1)

???

Some kits have more than two types of round in it, with the Russia Alternative Heavy-AT kit having 2x PG-7VL and 1x PG-7VR, compared with the normal Heavy-AT kit which only has 2x PG-7VRs, giving you more options :)

Psyko
2015-10-27, 20:19
you've done it again, jolly good show.

Raklodder
2015-10-27, 21:08
You deserve a cookie!

Strepto
2015-10-27, 21:53
Fantastic work!

Tit4Tat
2015-10-27, 22:09
nice work!

Explo
2015-10-28, 00:06
Nice work, looking forward to mix up rounds against APC/Tanks!
Now if only we could get some Carl Gustavs in with different rockets 8)

Raphavenger
2015-10-28, 02:30
You have set high standards for your work Rhino!
Always pleased to see some of your incredible results!

obpmgmua
2015-10-28, 05:13
God freaking damnit, I'm impressed with the dedication of this team. This is why I keep coming back. Look I've said it before I'll say it again, you guys have the potential to make a genre defining game that will definitely be a commercial success. All you have to do is take the core of PR and repackage it into a more accessible product. I dont understand why you'd rather wallow in obscurity when Fame and Fortune is yours for the taking. We need a good middle ground FPS game, I work closely with the entertainment industry, all the products that come across my desk are garbage, absolute garbage. It's hard to convince people to buy trash when the product does not invigorate me; the guy they hire to make their advertising campaigns. The market needs a good core FPS, that's the only category that's under served and has a huge sales potential. Fuck the hardcore market, let Squad and Arma battle it out, for the nichest of niches.

fatalsushi83
2015-10-28, 09:33
Amazing! And thanks for adding alt AT kits to MEC like the community suggested. Heavy AT for ARF is also nice.

Have you found a way of getting the airburst to work with this crappy old engine?

Mats391
2015-10-28, 09:57
Amazing! And thanks for adding alt AT kits to MEC like the community suggested. Heavy AT for ARF is also nice.

Have you found a way of getting the airburst to work with this crappy old engine?

This one is not in sadly. Currently we are missing a proper kit geometry for MEC with RPG-7 on the back :(

Rhino
2015-10-28, 10:05
Cheers guys.

I would also like to point out that this is more than just a face lift and the new warheads are more optimized than the old ones.

With the old standard RPG round having 404 tris where the new PG-7VM has only 322 tris since its detail is mostly done though normal maps, baked from a high poly model, where the old RPG rounds didn't have any normal maps and all their detail was though the 3D model. Don't also be confused by the new ones having less detail as actually they are rounded, with having more sides on the large parts than the old RPG rounds with the old round only having 16 sides on its largest part (which is larger than the new PG-7VM) and the new round has 24 sides. It is also worth noting the old standard RPG round had no LODs and the new one has a full set of LODs, making them easier to draw from a distance.

Old Round:
http://i.imgur.com/SE6wnku.jpg

New PG-7VM Round:
http://i.imgur.com/fjtwnBI.jpg

New PG-7VM Round's High Poly Model it got its normals from:
http://i.imgur.com/BnB7caj.jpg


Its the same story for all the other rounds, with comparing the old PG-7VR Tandem round which has 564 tris, to the new one which only has 428 tris.


Texture usage is a tiny bit more when comparing the standard round with the PG-7VM but this is mainly down to it having a normal map where the old one didn't, and the way I've used common textures throughout the common parts with all the rounds, which overall saves a lot more space, since the old RPG round and the old tandem round together cost 2mbs in textures, but the new ones together only cost 1.5mb of textures together so overall, a saving and the saving becomes greater once you start adding on all the different rounds compared to the old system which was one of the main reasons I totally threw away the old rounds.

Old Rocket Textures (total of 2mb):
http://i.imgur.com/58lXxMN.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/MLKlN6O.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/L4ysdqm.jpg

New Common Rocket, PG-7VM & PG-7VR Textures (total of 1.5mb):
http://i.imgur.com/0CxnIBX.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/y25LC76.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/d1Jjpax.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/2qV3dYO.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/baCpAIw.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/QSE0uN5.jpg


Have you found a way of getting the airburst to work with this crappy old engine?

So far we haven't found a perfect solution but we do have a fall-back plan if we can't find one but isn't a good as we would like.

Mats391;2102017']This one is not in sadly. Currently we are missing a proper kit geometry for MEC with RPG-7 on the back :(

You had listed it as done on your to do list, should have checked the files.

It would also be interesting to hear some feedback from the community on this matter since many of us feel the wrong kit geoms is not a show stopper for putting in a new feature like this where some of us feel it is.

ChallengerCC
2015-10-28, 10:07
realy great work

Xander[nl]
2015-10-28, 10:51
Will there be any in-game indication what type of warheads are used so the average player who isn't a dedicated HAT specialist will somewhat know how to aim? I'm a seasoned player myself but I rarely use HAT kits so I can already see myself completely failing (and with me, most other players) when a necessity forces me to pick up such kit. It's already happening with the SMAW and its unexpectedly high drop.

StealthyWarrior96
2015-10-28, 13:25
Nice Work! Cant wait for patch to be released, so I can to learn all new things.

Souls Of Mischief
2015-10-28, 18:04
Why are you guys so based?

SprintJack
2015-10-28, 19:05
Great work, looks so sexy :)


Rhino;2102020']
You had listed it as done on your to do list, should have checked the files.

It would also be interesting to hear some feedback from the community on this matter since many of us feel the wrong kit geoms is not a show stopper for putting in a new feature like this where some of us feel it is.

So we would have MEC alt Rifleman AT kit with RPG-27 on his back and RPG-7 in hands?
I really would not mind it at all.

mries
2015-10-28, 19:25
If the Alt mec kit geo is temporary I would not bother if it has the RPG-27 on its back and the RPG-7 in hands. I think it is a good solution, would love to see some differences between std and alt besides the weaponscope.

fatalsushi83
2015-10-29, 00:31
Same here. Gameplay is more important so I say put it in now and do the geometry later :D

Armchairman_Mao
2015-10-29, 01:52
No HE-Frag?

Also, will weapon icon show which class of warhead it belongs to?

I can see a bit of confusion for common plebs between light and medium type.

fatalsushi83
2015-10-29, 09:00
Can we do a poll about whether the MEC alt AT kits should be added into the next version or is it too late?

Mineral
2015-10-29, 09:35
For v1.3.5 that is by far too late :)

Rhino
2015-10-29, 13:46
Can we do a poll about whether the MEC alt AT kits should be added into the next version or is it too late?

Mineral;2102231']For v1.3.5 that is by far too late :)

If there is enough support for it we may possibly be able to look into adding them to a v1.3.5 hotfix but that mainly depends on if there is other stuff that really needs fixing, among other things.

EDIT: Made a Poll: https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f10-pr-bf2-general-discussion/138984-features-vs-aesthetics.html

No HE-Frag?

Not in v1.3.5 but as per the OP, we are going to add them in later versions with a bit of an overhaul to our kits :)

Also, will weapon icon show which class of warhead it belongs to?

I can see a bit of confusion for common plebs between light and medium type.

Currently there isn't no, if it proves too confusing for players we could possibly look into doing so but we don't want to clutter our selection icons up too much.

CG-Delta
2015-10-30, 20:46
Great, great, great. Thank you :)

Suggestion: You could for some factions give rileman AP a launcher with HE/frag grenades, maybe in exchange for claymore, or keep both. Too many kits with launcher?? I don't know. Seems like you're working on something in that area though: "...we are going to add them (HE-Frag) in later versions with a bit of an overhaul to our kits :-)" - Rhino.

Question. Are all MBTs considered to have reactive armour in-game although they don't have it. It seems like that's the case as of now.

Kavelenko
2015-11-07, 23:34
Rhino, thanks for such a comprehensive explanation of the RPG-7 updates, so good I'm subscribing to this thread for future reference!

Kav

fatalsushi83
2015-11-09, 02:09
I love these new warheads. It was so much fun playing as Taliban on Kokan and getting to chose from among these.

Now here's my question:
Which vehicles are considered to have reactive armor in game?

M42 Zwilling
2015-11-09, 02:50
Reactive armor isn't currently represented ingame, all tank armors work the same.

camo
2015-11-09, 03:18
The ones with reactive armour "bricks" on them. So t90, challenger 2 and a few others i think. But in terms of gameplay they make no difference, r/l mechanics of era are not present in pr.

EDIT: ninja'd

Rhino
2015-11-09, 19:09
Cheers guys, glad you like them :)

Now here's my question:
Which vehicles are considered to have reactive armor in game?

basically all tanks currently, with the Tandem warheads basically having the damage material of a Heavy Anti-Tank weapon, where the non-Tandem warheads have the Light Anti-Tank damage material, although the bigger ones like the PG-7VL and the Cobrra have a massive amount of damage though this material, but when used on tank armour it doesn't penetrate as well as a HAT/Tandem weapon.

In time with any luck we might go for a much better armour system in PR but this would take a hell of a lot of work in overhauling our material and damage systems.

Roque_THE_GAMER
2015-11-09, 20:27
Russia: Heavy-AT (x2)
Russia: Heavy-AT Alternativew (x1)

why would we chose the alternative if its have only one shoot?

Rhino
2015-11-09, 23:06
Russia: Heavy-AT (x2)
Russia: Heavy-AT Alternativew (x1)

why would we chose the alternative if its have only one shoot?

As I said before in this topic:
Rhino;2101935']Some kits have more than two types of round in it, with the Russia Alternative Heavy-AT kit having 2x PG-7VL and 1x PG-7VR, compared with the normal Heavy-AT kit which only has 2x PG-7VRs, giving you more options :)

Making the Alternative HAT a better choice if your mainly dealing with APCs/IFVs, since the PG-7VL will kill them easily and has a longer range with also having an extra round to fire, but the primary kit is better if your dealing with tanks.

fatalsushi83
2015-11-10, 02:57
Thanks, that answers my question.

Roque_THE_GAMER
2015-11-10, 09:27
Rhino;2105650']As I said before in this topic:


Making the Alternative HAT a better choice if your mainly dealing with APCs/IFVs, since the PG-7VL will kill them easily and has a longer range with also having an extra round to fire, but the primary kit is better if your dealing with tanks.

so the one shoot version can kill tanks with one hit in the front? other wise i don't see reason to use it.

liamap
2015-11-22, 14:32
Great job!

XAHTEP39
2015-12-19, 19:38
Rhino;2105650']
Making the Alternative HAT a better choice if your mainly dealing with APCs/IFVs, since the PG-7VL will kill them easily and has a longer range with also having an extra round to fire, but the primary kit is better if your dealing with tanks.
1. What is the "medium" warheads (PG-7VL,Cobra,Iranian tandem) power? I understand, that medium warhead doesn`t oneshoots APCs (Uliyanovsk, I shooted one PG-7VL at side of Fuchs with close rang ~70m, and Fuchs was not destory or even tracked!) ?

2. And global question for R-DEVs. How many "points of damage" have AT weapons?
1) RPG-7 with PG-7V -?
2) RPG-7 with PG-7VM-?
3) RPG-7 with PG-7VS -?
4) RPG-7 with PG-7VL "Luch"-?
5) RPG-7 with PG-7VR "Resume" (tandem) = 700 points (R-DEV`s post №22 in this topic (https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f10-pr-bf2-general-discussion/138984-features-vs-aesthetics-3.html))
6) RPG-7 with "Cobra warhead"-?
7) RPG-7 with Iranian warhead = 550 points (R-DEV`s post №22 in this topic (https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f10-pr-bf2-general-discussion/138984-features-vs-aesthetics-3.html))
8 ) RPG-26-?
9) М136 АТ-4 / L2A1 ILAW-?
10) М72 LAW-?
11) Eryx = 825 points (R-DEV`s post №22 in this topic (https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f10-pr-bf2-general-discussion/138984-features-vs-aesthetics-3.html))
12) SRAW / MBT LAW-?
13) SMAW-?
14) Matador-?
15) Pzf-3 with DM12A1-?
16) Pzf-3 with DM22 (tandem)-?
17) PF-89-?
18 ) PF-98-?
19) TOW-?
20) HJ-8-?
21) Milan-?
22) SPG-9 (HEAT)-?
23) 9P148 Konkurs (Spandrel, ATGM based on BRDM-2)-?
24) 9P149 Sturm-S (Spiral, ATGM Sturm or Ataka based on MTLB)-?
25) 9M14 Malutka (Sagger, ATGM of BMP-1)-?
26) 9M111 Fagot (Spigot) or 9M113 Konkurs (Spandrel)? (ATGM of BMP-2)-?
27) 9M133 Kornet (Spriggan, ATGM of BMP-2M)-?
28 ) 9M117 Basnja (Stabber, ATGM of BMP-3)-?
29) 9M119 Invar (Sniper, ATGM of Т-90А)-?
30) APFSDS Т-90А-?
31) HEAT Т-90А-?
32) AT-mine (TM-62, M15)-?
33) Yelow press canister IED-?
34) RKG-3-?
35) French rifle HEAT grenade (AC-58)-?
:-)

Rhino
2015-12-19, 21:09
1. What is the "medium" warheads (PG-7VL,Cobra,Iranian tandem) power? I understand, that medium warhead doesn`t oneshoots APCs (Uliyanovsk, I shooted one PG-7VL at side of Fuchs with close rang ~70m, and Fuchs was not destory or even tracked!) ?

2. And global question for R-DEVs. How many "points of damage" have AT weapons?
1) RPG-7 with PG-7V -?
2) RPG-7 with PG-7VM-?
3) RPG-7 with PG-7VS -?
4) RPG-7 with PG-7VL "Luch"-?
5) RPG-7 with PG-7VR "Resume" (tandem) = 700 points (R-DEV`s post №22 in this topic (https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f10-pr-bf2-general-discussion/138984-features-vs-aesthetics-3.html))
6) RPG-7 with "Cobra warhead"-?
7) RPG-7 with Iranian warhead = 550 points (R-DEV`s post №22 in this topic (https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f10-pr-bf2-general-discussion/138984-features-vs-aesthetics-3.html))
8 ) RPG-26-?
9) М136 АТ-4 / L2A1 ILAW-?
10) М72 LAW-?
11) Eryx = 825 points (R-DEV`s post №22 in this topic (https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f10-pr-bf2-general-discussion/138984-features-vs-aesthetics-3.html))
12) SRAW / MBT LAW-?
13) SMAW-?
14) Matador-?
15) Pzf-3 with DM12A1-?
16) Pzf-3 with DM22 (tandem)-?
17) PF-89-?
18 ) PF-98-?
19) TOW-?
20) HJ-8-?
21) Milan-?
22) SPG-9 (HEAT)-?
23) 9P148 Konkurs (Spandrel, ATGM based on BRDM-2)-?
24) 9P149 Sturm-S (Spiral, ATGM Sturm or Ataka based on MTLB)-?
25) 9M14 Malutka (Sagger, ATGM of BMP-1)-?
26) 9M111 Fagot (Spigot) or 9M113 Konkurs (Spandrel)? (ATGM of BMP-2)-?
27) 9M133 Kornet (Spriggan, ATGM of BMP-2M)-?
28 ) 9M117 Basnja (Stabber, ATGM of BMP-3)-?
29) 9M119 Invar (Sniper, ATGM of Т-90А)-?
30) APFSDS Т-90А-?
31) HEAT Т-90А-?
32) AT-mine (TM-62, M15)-?
33) Yelow press canister IED-?
34) RKG-3-?
35) French rifle HEAT grenade (AC-58 )-?
:-)

There isn't an exact "points of damage" a warhead makes, its a little more complex than that as it very much depends on what type of target it hits, and explodes near etc.

I don't have time to work out all the exact damages of every warhead, Vs. every type of material but I will give you a quick tutorial, using the PG-7VL as an example, on how to work them out yourself.

First of all you will need a text editor, "notepad" that comes with windows is the simplest but I would recommend getting Notepad++ (https://notepad-plus-plus.org/) with also the PR:BF2 Syntax files (https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f388-pr-bf2-community-modding/105162-bf2-syntax-files-text-editors-editplus-notepad-etc.html) to help you navigate the code more easily.

Ideally you will also want to set up a "pr_edit (https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f189-modding-tutorials/14468-setting-up-bf2-editor-pr-mapping-modding.html)" but you can manually extract the files as you need from the .zips, but in this tutorial I will be writing it like you've got a "pr_edit"

Next you will want to download the http://realitymodfiles.com/rhino/editor/MaterialEditor.zip and extract that into your "\pr_edit\common\Material\" folder along side your "materialManagerDefine.con" and your "materialManagerSettings.con" that come out of your "common_server.zip" file.



Before we begin there are two main types of ways things can be damaged in BF2 that you need to understand:

Contact Damage - which is how much damage is dealt/taken when a projectile hits a surface directly to the object that surface belongs to,.
Explosion Damage - which is how much damage is dealt/taken when a projectile explodes near an object, although this varies considerably depending on how far away something explodes and I do not have an exact formula myself to work out how much damage is taken depending on how far away the explosion is, so for all my calculations I'm going to assume the projectile explodes right on the object in its worst case scenario.



Now first thing to do is navigate to the projectile you want to identify its damage. Some projectiles are in the actual weapon or vehicles .tweak file and are created along with the vehicle/weapons "GenericFireArm" but most, even for handheld weapons are created in their own .con/.tweak file, with most of the normal projectiles being found in "\pr_edit\objects\weapons\common\projectiles\". However since our PG-7VL is a rocket/missile, you will find it in "\pr_edit\objects\weapons\Armament\missiles\rpg7_wa rheads\" in the "rpg7_warhead_pg7vl_con" folder. There is also a "_ins" version but they are coded excatly the same, just have different textures with "_con" used by conventional forces (Russians) and "_ins" being used by guerrilla forces (Militia).

Open up the .tweak file found in there, in this case the "rpg7_warhead_pg7vl_con.tweak" file and in this file you will find all of the settings of this particular projectile, form how it flies, what explosion and trail effects it uses, its LOD distance settings, what sounds it uses and of course, how much damage it deals. if you look in the "DefaultDetonationComp" you will see that this warhead has an "ObjectTemplate.detonation.explosionDamage" (Explosion Damage) of "100" on line #23. And on line #60 you will see it has a "ObjectTemplate.damage" (Contact Damage) Setting of "450". But what dose this mean? Well to find out we need to find something for it to be shot against.


Since you asked about the "Fuchs" lets use that as our target vehicle. Browse to "\pr_edit\objects\vehicles\Land\ger_apc_fuchs\" and in their you will find the vehicles .tweak file (ger_apc_fuchs.tweak). If we open that up we get all the settings of this vehicle, and the main ones we are instead in is in its "ObjectTemplate.createComponent Armor" = Armour Component, but also the Materials this vehicle uses (ObjectTemplate.mapMaterial).

Firstly lets look at its Armour settings and we can see that it has "ObjectTemplate.armor.hitPoints 1300", which means it starts off with 1,300 points of health, or "HP" (Health Points). What is also important to note is its "ObjectTemplate.armor.criticalDamage", which in this case is set to "130", which indicates the point at when this vehicle starts to burn/bleed to death. Also "ObjectTemplate.armor.hpLostWhileCriticalDamage 3.25" indicates how much HP is lost every second while its burning/bleeding. This means that once the Fuchs gets down to 130 HP, out of a total of 1,300 HP, it will start to bleed at 3.25 HP/Second, meaning that at best, the crew has 40seconds to bail out in before the vehicle explodes, but in reality this time is normally much lower since the last blast normally puts it well under its critical damage point.

Now moving onto this APCs materials, we can see that it has a total of 4 materials:
ObjectTemplate.mapMaterial 0 Armor_3_tank_rear_top 27
ObjectTemplate.mapMaterial 1 Armor_2_light_armored_vehicles 28
ObjectTemplate.mapMaterial 2 Armor_Glass_APCs 181
ObjectTemplate.mapMaterial 3 Rubber_heavy 102

And this is where each of the materials is placed on the vehicle:
http://i.imgur.com/ROkAzuu.jpg

The text stating what each material is, is actually pretty meaningless and often, very misleading since the actual thing that really matters is the very last number on the end I've highlighted in bold and underlined for each material.

Now if we go back and open your "MaterialEditor.exe" in your "\pr_edit\common\Material\" Folder, you will now be able to see all the materials in the mod and their settings in this UI.
Now in your "Destination Material Filter" (Dst Filter) box, type in one of the material numbers above, like I'm going to start with the first material on our list which is "27", which while listed in the .tweak file as "Armor_3_tank_rear_top", is actually "Armour_2_light_armoured_vehicle".

Here comes the point where we can actually start to find how much damage our rocket dose against this APC. Go back into your projectiles .tweak file (rpg7_warhead_pg7vl_con.tweak) and your looking for the "ObjectTemplate.material" line, which indicates what "Contact Damage Material" this projectile deals, which in this case is "3706". Type this number into the "Source Material Filter" (Src Filter) and you will find its the "PR_MISSILE_HEAVYAT" Material. With both your Source and Destination Materials selected, if you look down on the right hand side you will also see under the "Material Settings Properties" a "damageMod" setting, as well as what effect and sound templates are attached to this material. The "damageMod" is the important bit and this basically means how many times the damage setting of the projectile, is multiplied when it hits this material surface, which in this case, it has a "damageMod 2" setting.
http://i.imgur.com/75ASqXU.jpg


Now we found before that the PG-7VL projectile has a Contact Damage of "ObjectTemplate.damage 450". So if we multiply this by its "damageMod 2" setting: 450 x 2 = 900 damage, vs the Fuchs "27" Material, so that damage, minus the Fuchs total HP of 1300: 1300 - 900 = 400 HP remaining after being hit, assuming it had full HP before hand, which is somewhat above its 130 HP Critical Damage point, so it would not be burning although there would be a strong chance at this point for the vehicle to be tracked etc.



But keeping in mind, that is only the "Contact Damage" we have worked out and we still have to work out the "Explosion Damage". If we look at the Projectiles .tweak file we can see it has a "ObjectTemplate.detonation.explosionDamage 100" and a "ObjectTemplate.detonation.explosionMaterial 127". So first put the "127" into your Src Filter in the MaterialEditor.exe and then we need to look up the Fuchs
"ObjectTemplate.armor.defaultMaterial" which in this case is "172", since Explosion Damage only affects the Default Material of an object and not the actual surface materials on its collision mesh like Contact Damage dose, and put this material (172) into your "Dst Filter" in the MaterialEditor.exe and you will how each material affects each other. Other than in this case, the "Material Setting Properties is blank, since no material cell has been created for these two materials, which then means it uses the default "damageMod" setting of 1.
http://i.imgur.com/sIV7Ou2.jpg

So this means the rockets Explosion Damage of "100" is multiplied by 1: 100 x 1 = 100, which means it dose 100 damage. This is on top of the 900 Contact damage we worked out above, so the total damage that is dealt is 1000, leaving 300 HP on the Fuchs, assuming it was full HP before it was hit, and still shy of the 130 Critical Damage point of the vehicle but still, wouldn't take much to finish it off.


Now this example was only against one vehicle and also only one material on the vehicle where it would do more or less damage, hitting other materials on the same vehicle, which is why I'm not going to work out all of the above for you and why I've just written this tut so you can work them out for yourself if you choose :)


PS. Fixed the Fuchs having a stronger top armour material than its side armour as seen above, now has material 26 for its top armour instead of 28.

Cheers!

CG-Delta
2015-12-22, 20:45
1. What is the "medium" warheads (PG-7VL,Cobra,Iranian tandem) power? I understand, that medium warhead doesn`t oneshoots APCs (Uliyanovsk, I shooted one PG-7VL at side of Fuchs with close rang ~70m, and Fuchs was not destory or even tracked!) ?

Not an answer to your question, but I'll just add that you cannot make the conclusion, that medium warheads cannot one-shoot-kill an APC based on one data count. It isn't that consistent. Examples: I've made an angled shot with a SRAW ((HAT)wire guided HEAT) on a supply truck. It almost caught flames :P. Also I've taken a 90 deg ("right on") side hit SPG-9 hit on Stryker -> just a bit of smoke (although I consider SPG-9 a fearsome killer).
It's inconsistent (especially in battle), and though I think that there's not much difference in APC/IFV armour, there's still a difference there you may consider other than; APC/not APC.

Rhino
2015-12-22, 21:03
TBH in hindsight the damage of the Medium sized warheads probably do need to be reworked. I thought originally they had the LAT damage material but turns out, they have the HAT (which they really shouldn't since HAT should be reserved for Tandem Warheads). This is not to mention we ideally need to rework out entire material system and col meshes for vehicles from scratch but the first is a massively time consuming task and second is a next to impossible task :p