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View Full Version : Speed vs armour in vehicles (from tanks to Logi's).


Mikemonster
2011-12-18, 10:25
Whilst pondering the Suggestion about having a Mobile Command and Control vehicle it occurred to me that if one was implemented it would have armour, be able to withstand small arms, but would be more vulnerable than the current logi trucks.

This isn't really right in my opinion.. Surely a big heavy vehicle with armour should be less vulnerable to an enemy infantry squad than a [supposedly] unarmoured 5tonne truck.

Expanding further, I think that the traditional compromise between armour and manoeverablilty in PR is definately skewed against the armour. I.e. it's much better in PR to be in something that's fast than something that's armoured.

This might represent a realistic battlefield, it might not, I'm not sure. It just struck me as odd.


TL;DR - It's safer to whizz around in a fast jeep than it is to ride a slow, loud, HAT vulnerable APC.

Tarranauha200
2011-12-18, 16:37
Yep. Jeeps are usually too armored for small arms but not valuable enough targets for HAT.

Stealthgato
2011-12-18, 17:27
Damage from small arms against light unarmored vehicles in PR is completely unrealistic.

lromero
2011-12-20, 02:52
Agreed, some insurgent unarmored vehicles take way too long to take out even with a 50.cal. Some light armored vehicles are just way too armored. Although it might be for game balancing it really doesn't seem realistic, and the only reason I mentioned insurgency was because that's where it is most noticeable. AAS with conventional factions isn't too much of a problem.

Mikemonster
2011-12-20, 11:20
Aside from when you drive a logi truck through enemy lines on Muttrah or any other map to make a set of Ninja FOBs :)

I'd be surprised if in a full scale conventional battle Company or Battalion commanders were ordering supply trucks accross the enemy lines because they are faster than APC's and therefore less vulnerable to enemy AT weapons.

Don't forget, if you are wounded you can just patch up when you've dropped the crate and then build the FOB.

40mmrain
2011-12-21, 01:18
speed is one of the reasons the LAV both 3 and 25 are so awesome.

The thing is most vehicles have to be stationary to fire accurately, so even the fastest vehicles are vulnerable while firing. The reason fast jeeps are safe, is because youre usually not stopping to fire on targets, unlike a tank or something.

Hunt3r
2012-01-19, 00:53
Aside from when you drive a logi truck through enemy lines on Muttrah or any other map to make a set of Ninja FOBs :)

I'd be surprised if in a full scale conventional battle Company or Battalion commanders were ordering supply trucks accross the enemy lines because they are faster than APC's and therefore less vulnerable to enemy AT weapons.

Don't forget, if you are wounded you can just patch up when you've dropped the crate and then build the FOB.

Except, you know, logi trucks IRL are much slower on anything but solid roads, and ATGMs have no problem accounting for the target's speed?

Mikemonster
2012-01-19, 16:36
So you're saying slow logi trucks down over uneven terrain? Seems reasonable to me, the tanks/APC's should have better speed cross country.

And in game the ATGM will have a slower moving Logi truck to hit as well, vs the tank. Seems reasonable as well.

Do you understand my point, currently Logi trucks have more survivability than armour.

ShockUnitBlack
2012-01-22, 03:23
Damage from small arms against light unarmored vehicles in PR is completely unrealistic.Depends how you look at it. A single good or lucky shot to the engine block could very well disable the entire vehicle, while blasting away at doors and such (even with a .50 cal) isn't going to do much of anything (although it could kill the vehicle's passengers).

I can't comment on the effectiveness of rockets vs. light vehicles, although I will say I've heard of RPGs going straight through light armour without detonating.

badmojo420
2012-01-24, 03:41
I think a big part of this is that light unarmored vehicles pose little or no direct threat towards infantry. And the slower armored ones usually roll up and kill you quickly, therefore when infantry catch sight(or sound) of any armor, their mission quickly changes to 'hide and help eliminate the threat' but when they see fast moving vehicles the tendency is to report the sighting and only attempt an attack if it's easy.

But, I do think there is some work that needs to be done to the fast moving vehicles in the game. Pretty much all of the "light" vehicles accelerate far too fast. It shouldn't be a good strategy to sit beside a civi car and jump in and speed away at any sign of trouble.

Even if I could instantly be teleported into my drivers seat with the engine already running in real life, putting my car into gear and pulling away doesn't happen as quickly as it does in PR. And that's not even getting into off-road conditions where wheelspin or increased resistance would further increase acceleration times.

Mikemonster
2012-01-25, 15:43
That's a good point about the accelleration. Also I wonder how fast a big truck under fire can do a three point turn.

You're right about the Logi/trucks being targets only when in view, added to the fact that they aren't an immediate threat is that they are unchaseable.. Once out of sight that's it, they are gone for good really (especially on the big maps, with a very spread out playerbase). And not usually slow enough to risk wasting a LAT on.

Stealthgato
2012-01-26, 21:41
I find logistic trucks (or any truck in PR for that matter) to be fairly slow actually (not complaining). Even more the Russian/MEC/Militia/Chinese ones, which if there's the tiniest uphill climb they go slower than your crawl speed (now I'm complaining).

imjustthatguy
2012-01-30, 23:17
i think its fine, tanks are main priorities for HATS, and light armored vehicles are priorities for LATS, you only get one shot of them. i think they made humvees bulletproof too, but its fairly decent in speed, insurgents get the transport fake bomb car, it is easily vulnerable, but pretty fast if you shift it. it balances.

Raic
2012-05-04, 04:18
Except, you know, logi trucks IRL are much slower on anything but solid roads, and ATGMs have no problem accounting for the target's speed?
Ever driven them? Those things go faaaaaast, they just don't slow down so fast. :-P

I find logistic trucks (or any truck in PR for that matter) to be fairly slow actually (not complaining). Even more the Russian/MEC/Militia/Chinese ones, which if there's the tiniest uphill climb they go slower than your crawl speed (now I'm complaining).
I always have found that all vehicles in PR are still too slow, they should go lot faster and have slow gear on SHIFT to climb steep hills. Never met a hill I could not climb with a off-road truck. (They should also kill everyone inside if they hit something full speed.)

Bringerof_D
2012-05-15, 09:44
idea: what about a 6 second warm up time to drive any ground vehicle when hopping into the driver seat?

reason: well you need a few seconds to turn the thing over and put it in gear, thus giving any gunman a chance to take down the driver instead of him just speeding off the moment he hops in. This will also help to reduce TKs due to a guy running into the vehicle and still having his W key pressed when he enters thus jolting forward enough to run a guy over.

this will also encourage infantry moving with a vehicle to keep both a driver along with the gunner in the vehicle at all times, much like SOP in real life require.

@Raic: They do, if you have just a tiny bit of trouble going up a slope, hold shift. i'm pretty sure this is a feature that's been in PR for quite some time.

mockingbird0901
2012-06-18, 12:21
I really hope that has been suggested before, and gotten the message from the DEV's that it's hard coded and cant be done, because I've been thinking about that for ages, but it being such a simple idea I for one always though that that had to have been mentioned before.

Hunt3r
2012-06-26, 06:34
Combined Arms had some code for the logis at some point where it could reach a fast speed, but getting to it took a loooong time, as did slowing down. Made driving fast quite precarious, especially in tight cities.

DavviZ
2012-06-26, 10:03
I think it's unrealistic that a car/truck/jeep are able to run all the time untill it explodes. As many of you maybe have seen on youtube or mythbusters. A car dosent blow up even if you fill it with led from a M2 50cal. MG. I suggest that the cars in the game should be disabled (starts smoking badly and engine stops running, Puncture on the wheels etc) after taking a decent amount of damage from smallarmes. But it might be hard to combine the damagetaking from bullets and rockets/cannonshells. It still have to blow up when being hit by one (depending on what car/truck/jeep it is) but not to be to vulnerable to bullets.