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View Full Version : Choose the AU's sniper !


Sgt_Doctor
2011-09-27, 19:40
Hey folks !

I propose you something : Choose the AU's sniper. We currently use the Lee Enfield and I don't especially like the idea.

But ! The sniper must be already modelised in PR or in any BSS mod (if we have the right to use it, of course) and the proposition must be realistic !

Sgt_Doctor
2011-09-28, 15:56
*Cough* *cough*

Anyone ?

Sgt.BountyOrig
2011-09-28, 16:08
M24? Some PMC's lost it during ops?

Stealthgato
2011-09-28, 16:12
Mosin Nagant? Idk

dtacs
2011-09-28, 16:17
Yep, Mosin if the old model is still up to standard.

Failing that use the French one, IIRC many ex-French colonial nations use it as their precision rifle.

Sgt_Doctor
2011-09-28, 18:20
The model was in PR ?

MonkeySoldier
2011-09-28, 20:39
You could ask IDF for their scoped Mosin Nagant. Or modify the existing SKS of PR, by adding a scope on it. The SVD is an option as well. :)

BroCop
2011-09-28, 21:04
IIRC there was a Scoped Mosin a long time ago

simeon5541
2011-09-28, 21:52
AU - SSG1 or SV-98 (If China can use it AU can also (they use lot of Russian equipment in real life,
they are however not using this,but Russian Army is not using it neither,nor Chines ))

ARF - Lee Enfield

tankninja1
2011-09-29, 01:59
G3 with a more powerful scope, since G3 seem to be the 2nd most common weapon in more cheaply funded armies, next to the AK. Bound to be a few with a nice scope on them.

Redamare
2011-09-29, 03:24
well. . . SVD and G3 scoped are always good place holders :) but . . make G3 the main and SVD ALT . . . but as far as a FULL sniper rifle goes :l . .. . . hmm i would vote MOSIN until a new rifle can take its place

dtacs
2011-09-29, 06:55
Sgt_Doctor;1673123']The model was in PR ?
Yes, it was the sniper for Militia around 0.5-0.75.

Sabre-Oz
2011-09-29, 07:58
South African R1 (FN FAL)?

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y122/sabretron/R1SniperFTR.jpg

Following are from District 9;

http://i45.tinypic.com/5mwygx.png
http://i46.tinypic.com/r8a69d.png

dtacs
2011-09-29, 09:31
Keep it bolt action. A semi-auto sniper with the same damage as the snipers' rounds will be stupid. It can be argued that deviation will make firing semi impractical, but in that case what is the point of having it semi-automatic anyway.

Research it and have whatever bolt-action is most plentiful in African inventories, as opposed to weapons suggested via movies.

Sabre-Oz
2011-09-29, 11:45
The suggestion was based upon it already being on the same contenant and also the FAL already going to be in the arsenal, so the model to base it off is already there and of a standard that is acceptable.

Pictures from a film were used because there doesn't seem to be many of the R1 going around.

SADF units have apparently used the the SSG 69 if you want to use the same as another faction though and apply the same points as above. But I feel it would 'look' abit too modern for this faction.

A semi-auto sniper with the same damage as the snipers' rounds will be stupid

I would like to see Project Reality's damage be based upon the weapon, not the class.

Wakain
2011-09-29, 12:15
we might want to find out first if african nations have, and make use of special sniperunits.
svd's seem to be issued in pretty large numbers overall whereas it's hard to find a decent pic of a guy with a sniper rifle serving in an african country.

the (possible, mind you!) removal of a sniper class(again, if that's even possible due to pr's kit requestsystem) could lead to an even more assymetrical element in pr;)

Stealthgato
2011-09-29, 12:25
Ooh, R1 would be nice. Keep the Nagant for the Militia. Makes more sense than a Lee Enfield.

Sgt_Doctor
2011-09-29, 19:19
The South. Af. R1 looks fine for a marksman kit, but not for a sniper I think.

Stealthgato
2011-09-29, 23:01
Think it would be a nice change to have something other than a bolt-action for a sniper. Variety is the spice of life as they say.

A semi-auto sniper with the same damage as the snipers' rounds will be stupid.

Ehm... M21? Dragunov? SR-25? :/

dtacs
2011-09-30, 11:35
The M14 and Dragunov which are both in-game, don't do the same damage as the snipers from what I recall.

My point is a semi-automatic, scoped rifle that does one shot body kills at extreme range is unproductive for balanced gameplay

Stealthgato
2011-09-30, 12:22
They do even more. They kill with one shot to the body most of the times when for example the M24/M40/SV-98 don't. I meant the AR-10T instead of SR-25. Besides, there's a max of only 2 of them in a team and there's plenty of effective assets to take them out.

162eRI
2011-09-30, 17:11
Like Sgt_Doctor said, don't mistake marksman for sniper! You need two different kind of rifles for that. (and no other ways that AU got the SVD as marksman rifle)

If you could make a new model, I would go for the South African sniper rifle Truvelo .50 (http://cdn.24.co.za/files/Cms/General/d/1358/185ae351b9da4f9a814281c4c94be77a.jpg) (since, first, because the AU is using the South African R4 (or Galil, whatever) and because some African countries are using it, like Lybia as we saw on videos lately (http://www.defenceweb.co.za/images/stories/LAND/LAND_new/truvelo.jpg)...) But the caliber is too big for the game anyways...

Something related to BSS, either the M24 wooden version (Vietnam style, in many BSS mods) or something semi-auto, like the GALATZ (Galil Sniper in IDF mod I believe) or the FNFNAR (FN Fal sniper). Yeah I know it's semi-auto, but well, we are speaking about the African Union forces, not elite sniper forces... Thought not really sure if the two last ones are in BSS??

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2011/4/29/1304067639514/Misrata-rebel-leader-call-007.jpg
Some unknown bolt sniper rifle used in Lybia... ?

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSTm6LR-F_SuArH7oEpH2N_W3zPP_OtYRrMdgjp_Gt6V6OqapEYDhTZmRW Akg
Ivory Coast rebel in Abidjan

I hope it helps? Yeah, I know, like everytime I'm not really answering your question as you were asking for rifle snipers already in BSS LOL sorry mate ;)

simeon5541
2011-09-30, 19:39
I can't believe that 90 % of players that post here do not know difference between
marksman and sniper !!! :shock:

Guys, SVD,M14,M21,G3SG1,FAL with optics,Galil with optics,Tavor with optics adopted to long ranges are all used for marksman tasks,they are also automatic or semi-automatic
weapons and they are used at ranges to 700 meters (that is case in my country),
while SSG1,SV-98,M24,G22 and others are classic bolt high precision sniper rifles,
that can be used up to 1200 + meters.

African sniper kit should use bolt action sniper not some semi-automatic rifle,
even that would be old scoped Lee Enfield !!

But I think that good choice would be SSG1 (SSG69),
it is already in the game,and Togo is using it :

Steyr SSG 69 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steyr_SSG_69)

And why not SV-98 ?

162eRI
2011-10-01, 08:38
Exactly! Well, I believe that since we are talking about the AU's forces, the couldn't have conventional sniper forces like other modern countries, but well.

The SSG69 is a good choice if it's already ingame! It's a bolt action sniper rifle, looking very similar to the one in picture above, a simple rifle to handle for the AU's forces and it's a spread rifle around the world.
http://images.bf-games.net/news/2008/06/8111_0.jpg

Wakain
2011-10-01, 11:50
I recommend making using a wooden version of above rifle, as shown in the pic of the abidjani rebel, just to make the rifle different from the mec version

Adriaan
2011-10-01, 13:23
Matrox happens to have made a very nice wooden stock skin for the SSG recently, it would be perfect for the AU. :)

dtacs
2011-10-01, 13:32
The magazine on that thing is bizarre, I always thought it was too boxy and small to hold 5 rounds. Its a good choice though, especially if it can have some sort of older look to it.

For the ARF though, the Enfield and Mosin are good choices.

Sgt_Doctor
2011-10-01, 13:44
That could be a nice solution. Thanks all.

RUSSIAN147
2011-10-11, 01:01
The magazine on that thing is bizarre, I always thought it was too boxy and small to hold 5 rounds. Its a good choice though, especially if it can have some sort of older look to it.

For the ARF though, the Enfield and Mosin are good choices.

Completely agree dtacs, the Mosin would be awesome to have back ingame, and if not the SSG with a wooden stock would fill the role just as well.

DeltaFart
2011-10-11, 13:46
Whats wrong with the Enfield? Those things are bloody everywhere, why not have it as like an Alt?

Wakain
2011-10-11, 18:41
Whats wrong with the Enfield? Those things are bloody everywhere, why not have it as like an Alt?

the african theatre is a good opportunity to create an opfor that set's itself apart from the (middle eastern/afghanistani) unconventional opfor's we have already.

diversity is golden. as you say: LE's are everywhere, that's true, but scoped ones are generally quite rare.

DeltaFart
2011-10-12, 06:45
the african theatre is a good opportunity to create an opfor that set's itself apart from the (middle eastern/afghanistani) unconventional opfor's we have already.

diversity is golden. as you say: LE's are everywhere, that's true, but scoped ones are generally quite rare.

True enough though I doubt scoped mosin's are much more common :P i mean if they were I bet they'd be cheaper here in the US :D which would make me a very happy panda cuase I would love a scoped mosin

162eRI
2011-10-12, 18:20
Sniper in essence are rare. During WW2, all the countries had difficulties to produce binoculars and scopes, they even had to buy civilian ones. If today it became easy for healthy countries to have scopes, it's not the case for poor countries and unconventional armies. They rely on supplied sniper rifles (I guess mostly ex-soviet marksman rifles), they don't produce any! They are also using what I will call "civilian-like" sniper rifles, by that I mean "carbine" sniper.
We have to keep in mind that it's easy for them to buy this kind of carbine weapons and easier also to maintain. For unconventional forces and untrained troops, it's quite hard to maintain in good condition a modern complicated sniper rifle. Soviet-like scopes or carbine scopes are easier to employ for them.
And at last, you can still find Lee Enfield or Mosin snipers around the world (like in Afghanistan or Iraq) but they are rare. I really don't think this two weapons would fit with an African theatre of war!

Wakain
2011-10-12, 19:07
very true point
...And at last, you can still find Lee Enfield or Mosin snipers around the world (like in Afghanistan or Iraq) but they are rare. I really don't think this two weapons would fit with an African theatre of war!

my thoughts exactly, but if we were to choose between the two I'd prefer the nagant for diversity's sake. the proposed workaround (wooden version of MEC sniper) is the best choice anyway.

you mentioned the use of "ex-soviet marksmanrifles", I recall that I suggested somewhere (might be in this thread) that perhaps the sniperkit could be scrapped with the AU and the ARF to be replaced by the marksmanclass (as in having a sniperclass with a dragunov or having the sniper class scrapped altogether)
I'm not really sure of this is possible with pr's kitrequest system.

162eRI
2011-10-12, 20:23
you mentioned the use of "ex-soviet marksmanrifles", I recall that I suggested somewhere (might be in this thread) that perhaps the sniperkit could be scrapped with the AU and the ARF to be replaced by the marksmanclass (as in having a sniperclass with a dragunov or having the sniper class scrapped altogether)
I'm not really sure of this is possible with pr's kitrequest system.

Same here, also suggest it here somewhere, I believe African unconventional armies should perhaps use a scrap sniper/marksman kit as, after all, sniper are very very rare in Africa. Marksman are more common, mostly because ex-soviet rifles were widespread around African.
Also, for gameplay reasons, I don't know if it could be possible... Otherwise, other unconventional forces in PR should have the same scrap kit. And in the end, there are snipers in Africa, even if rare, and this is a fictionnal faction, they could have buy "carbine" sniper rifles (wooden version of MEC sniper, even if it doesn't exist).

Anyway, it's not a big deal, just a very few guys will get this sniper rifle per maps (1 or 2?), so in the end, does it really change something? (for exemple, everybody already got binoculars when in reality most don't)

BroCop
2011-10-12, 20:30
But isnt the AU the conventional faction and therefore its valid to have a sniper?

162eRI
2011-10-12, 20:57
Yes, indeed, it's a fictionnal conventional African faction I believe. Sgt_Doctor is the one that can answer you on this case. I went out of topic with Wakain xD

simeon5541
2011-10-13, 10:34
Just give them SSG1 . . .
And AU is not ficional,
it is just not working that way like it will be in PR . . .

Wakain
2011-10-13, 12:44
Also, for gameplay reasons, I don't know if it could be possible... Otherwise, other unconventional forces in PR should have the same scrap kit. And in the end, there are snipers in Africa, even if rare, and this is a fictionnal faction, they could have buy "carbine" sniper rifles (wooden version of MEC sniper, even if it doesn't exist).

Anyway, it's not a big deal, just a very few guys will get this sniper rifle per maps (1 or 2?), so in the end, does it really change something? (for exemple, everybody already got binoculars when in reality most don't)
true, I just think it could be interesting to have such difference in organisation and weapon loadout. blufor factions will all field their respective high-tech and high-powered rifles, vehicles etc. but in general they seem to be fielding the same sort of roles (rifleman specialist is exceptional as it appears to be a mostly british-american invention, but it's easy enough for other factions to find a workaround here) and similar classes of vehicles, organisation seems to be comparable.

it's the opfor, and in this I mean the conventional factions like MEC and UA, that have the potential to be very different. they are different already of course, fielding mostly older weapons and vehicles, but they still seem to come with the same organisation, their kits may look and behave different but they're basically the same compared to conventional factions.

I just want to point out that there appears to be some kind of mould as to what a faction needs to have in terms of assets and kit-loadouts, regardless of whether the faction itself makes great use, or has great emphasis on these assets (I'm actually mainly referring to kit-loadouts). Like with the russian faction, it's great they have their own sniperrifle but as several russians pointed out on this forum, the russian army hardly makes use of dedicated snipers. I guess the same thing applies with the UA (or appears to apply to me, I'm far from an expert on the African semi-conventional armies).

but as you said, its not a big deal, we're striving for reality but it remains a game and thus has to be playable. also, the above may seem to be a rant/excessively negative critic about the way pr's factions are (being) developed. this is not really the case as I love them all as they are or will be, I merely wanted to highlight a point that might deserve/lead to further discussion.

lucky.BOY
2011-10-14, 15:00
You are on to something, Wakian and 162eRI, but there might be some downsides to your proposion.

1) there would probably be a need to change the way kit requesting works, as it seems to be hardcoded (in terms it cant depend on faction). If im not mistaken (and hopefully I am) this would need a big deal of work to implement

2) There would be another thing to turn new players away from PR, as they would need to learn what kits each faction feature to be ale to play this game fully.

dont want to be a b*|ch but each suggestion need a constructive critism to evolve. Dont beat me :)

-lucky

Wakain
2011-10-14, 16:34
dont want to be a b*|ch but each suggestion need a constructive critism to evolve. Dont beat me :)
ah man, you're such a b*|ch for helping us by providing constructing criticism, please never do that ever again, or things might only improve!:p

1) there would probably be a need to change the way kit requesting works, as it seems to be hardcoded (in terms it cant depend on faction). If im not mistaken (and hopefully I am) this would need a big deal of work to implement
this is a point I was wondering about already, I don't know enough about this system to really have an impression what the possibilities are here, and how much work altering this system might need.

a solution might be to fill the sniperslot with a factionspecific "bonuskit" an alternative rifleman or something with a weapon that is a little bit rarer to find in the factions respective arsenals. (a modern fn fal version instead of a wooden version for instance, or an ak74 insetad of an aks-47)
hoewever it depends whether the sniper can be renamed in the current system for specific factions.
another solution might be to keep the sniper, give it a marksman rifle, keep the marksman and give it an assault rifle with very basic optics, however this might not be applicable to certain factions with very basic or oldschool weaponry.

2) There would be another thing to turn new players away from PR, as they would need to learn what kits each faction feature to be ale to play this game fully.
I personally think most new players will start with conventional (blufor) factions first, and I furthermore think that the detail provided with and the difference between specific (opfor) factions will outweigh the added learning curve.

thanks for your time

Wakain

BroCop
2011-10-14, 18:18
Bro's about the availability of kits to certain factions I am going to mention the Militia Pilot (unless the Russian pilot kit is also blocked)

Wakain
2011-10-15, 15:25
Bro's about the availability of kits to certain factions I am going to mention the Militia Pilot (unless the Russian pilot kit is also blocked)

I'm affraid I do not understand, please explain.

BroCop
2011-10-15, 16:33
Well seeing how I was a bit derp and I herped when reading the 2 posts I have to say the ultimate word: "Nevermind"


:p

Stealthgato
2011-10-15, 18:27
Well seeing how I was a bit derp and I herped when reading the 2 posts I have to say the ultimate word: "Nevermind"


:p

No, you're right. As I understood it, someone proposed having the AU without sniper class, then someone mentioned they think it is hardcoded regarding having one faction without a kit and the other with it available but it is not, for example Militia vs. British, British can request pilot kit but Militia doesn't have it, or Hamas vs. IDF, IDF can request pilot and crewman but Hamas doesn't have them.

162eRI
2011-10-15, 21:55
Can't add anything as the above arguments said it all.

Indeed Stealthgato, and furthermore, like the insurgents, we can have "pickupable" kits. So for exemple the African wouldn't be able to request the sniper kit, but they could find it in the map's mainbase.

Wakain
2011-10-16, 11:31
Can't add anything as the above arguments said it all.

Indeed Stealthgato, and furthermore, like the insurgents, we can have "pickupable" kits. So for exemple the African wouldn't be able to request the sniper kit, but they could find it in the map's mainbase.

that would be a good solution, making the sniperkit in african armies existing but very rare, problem is that at some point all sniperfanatics will know where it is and rush off with it from the first minute. a heavy spawndelay or randomized spawnlocation (again if possible) could tackle that issue though.

then again, how will pickupkits work with (semi)conventional armies that should rely heavily on squads. it would be detrimental if someone in a squad was to stumble on such a sniperkit by accident and he would keep it in a squad, or he'd just leave the squad and create his own, causing uneffective squads and potential confusion (we already have that sometimes in pr as it is and should be discouraged as much as possible)

interesting discussion guys :)

Von_Gnome
2011-10-17, 15:33
I don't understand why it would be hardcoded to not have a sniperkit in the list? On Ins the kit-request menu is blocked. And in case you can't block single kit in the list, just fill it with something else.

BroCop
2011-10-17, 17:52
I think we already concluded that you can block a specific kit for a specific faction

RUSSIAN147
2011-10-18, 02:48
Whats wrong with the Enfield? Those things are bloody everywhere, why not have it as like an Alt?

Because PR needs to mix things up a bit, besides the Taliban, HAMAS, Insurgents and Chechens use the N0.4 already, why not add a new gun into the fray??

rushn
2011-10-18, 04:10
Because PR needs to mix things up a bit, besides the Taliban, HAMAS, Insurgents and Chechens use the N0.4 already, why not add a new gun into the fray??

problem is who is going to make it?

BroCop
2011-10-18, 08:16
I think we already concluded that its already made.

ShavedAlpaca
2011-10-18, 20:04
put a wooden stock on the ssg + call it a hunting rifle = profit

simeon5541
2011-10-18, 23:47
SSG1. . .

06ua94
2011-11-05, 23:04
SVD Dragunov ? :D

Howitzer
2011-11-07, 20:37
and the marksman would be a AK74 with a PSO1

simeon5541
2011-11-08, 21:49
Togo Togo Togo Togo Togo !! xD