[Faction] Guinean Gulf Organisation Forces

[Pte.Paynter]

Originally Posted by Anhkhoa

I was bored so I drew this up for you guys.
GGOF Design Plan





Pictures and suggest to follow tommorow.

Good job mate looks good imo.

P.S if you also need help with this faction PM 163, and tell me what I can do.

Thank you.

[Anhkhoa]

Originally Posted by [R-CON]162eRI

Sherman is "outdated". Western African armies never used them (?) as they get Colonial tanks. (and today it's impossible to use them > where find the ammunitions or the spare parts?)
But I agree with you we need some light tanks or armored vehicles. The point is the French army don't use tanks in Africa, but light tanks and armored vehicles as well (like the ERC-90 Sagaie).

The African armies are using mostly T-55 tanks, some old English Centurion (?) and French AMX-13 or/and 30.
As light armored vehicles they are using a lot of French AML-90. All around Africa you can find them (even South Africa were they made copy of it). They are using also the ERC-90 but with the old turret.

Thanks for the design plan, I will take a look

The Sherman was just a product of quick thinking. (Shermans were used during the Invasion of North Africa, West Africa a bit south of North Africa...you get the point.) I really don't like the idea of using a ERC-90 as the African light tank, it just kinda mirrors the French. The Centurian MkIII and anything above it will kill the ERC-90 but I guess we could go with it as it's a great tank and is used in the area.

[162eRI]

Good job mate looks good imo.
P.S if you also need help with this faction PM 163, and tell me what I can do.
Thank you.

For this one, we have all the weapons we want except the recoiless rifle! But we all know someone here who may finish its model LOL
Thank you very much

The Sherman was just a product of quick thinking. (Shermans were used during the Invasion of North Africa, West Africa a bit south of North Africa...you get the point.) I really don't like the idea of using a ERC-90 as the African light tank, it just kinda mirrors the French. The Centurian MkIII and anything above it will kill the ERC-90 but I guess we could go with it as it's a great tank and is used in the area.

Well, I agree with the ERC-90 as French and African factions will get something far too more similar. But again, think of the AML-90.
Heavily used all around, still good enough to kick some ass but not enough to overpower an ERC-90. That's the best and more realistic choice ever. I've looking at all the African pictures of Military Photos website and find no other light tanks.

[Anhkhoa]

Originally Posted by [R-CON]162eRI

Well, I agree with the ERC-90 as French and African factions will get something far too more similar. But again, think of the AML-90.
Heavily used all around, still good enough to kick some ass but not enough to overpower an ERC-90. That's the best and more realistic choice ever. I've looking at all the African pictures of Military Photos website and find no other light tanks.

Ok then whatever you say
Your the R-Con

[eenis]

definately go with the FAL as the standard rifle, we gotta have a little fun in PR right? the g3 and ak get boring.

[Cheesygoodness]

Originally Posted by eenis

definately go with the FAL as the standard rifle, we gotta have a little fun in PR right? the g3 and ak get boring.

Well considering coding wise I'd assume the G3 and the FN Fal will have nearly the same statistics. Both fire the 7.62mm from a 20 round magazine and are considered battle rifles. In fact (And I can't source you at this time.) The G3 was 'developed' because of the French's unwillingness to give West Germany the license to produce the G1 (An FN Fal variant.)

Regardless it was really question on my part originally. Was there a plan to use the FN Fal without optical sights? I'd only like to see it assuming the model is complete. I'd never suggest that a model be created simply for that purpose when the AK-47 or the G3 could be used in its place.

[162eRI]

REALITY: The point is no Western African armies are using scopes (except for special military/police forces). Also if you are looking at all the pix you can find and all the documents you can read, African armies are using a lot of paramilitary units and/or commandos units. But don't be fooled, commandos units in African armies are not commandos units like you can find in Occidental armies. They are just more dangerous for the civilians and PW, loyal to their officer that they often put at the head of the country and they of course received better weapons...

The big idea is to make two different "armies" in the same faction ingame. They will look different, the conventional army with the Post-US Vietnam equipment (helmet, green uniforms with some camo equipments, officer with green beret) and the commandos with new equipments (red beret, camo uniforms and even M88 "fritz" helmet if they feet on EoD player class models)
-Ground forces: Officer (AK), Rifleman (AK), Support (RPK), Grenadier (AK & lot of grenades), Engineer (AKs), Medic (AKs), Rifleman AT (RPG), Marksman (AK+scope), Collaborator (AKs)
-Commandos: Officer (G3), Specialist (G3+scope), Rifleman (G3), Support (PKM), Grenadier (AK+UGL), Medic (FAL), Rifleman AT (Karl Gustav), Sniper (Dragunov).

-There will have a lot of Ground Forces Officer kits to take but really few Commandos Officer kits.
-AP mines are allowed and given to many infantry soldiers.
-You will have to pick up the few AA kits placed on the map.
-Some Chinese AK with scope will be available to pick up on some places of the map (China give more and more military equipment to the African countries. We can increase a little the number of scopes in the African army, but we can't give them scopes in the kits as they don't use them)
-No Heavy AT kits. To fight against tanks, you have to find statics AT weapons/recoiless rifle. The point is, France isn't using tanks in Africa, so they don't have to worry that much.

-We have to find something interesting for the armed collaborator to do. Those collaborator are like militia engaged by the army in local ethnic groups favorable to the regime.
For exemple if they died, the faction don't lost tickets as they are civilian engaged in the army and easily replaceable?!


Vehicles
-Pick up armed with: heavy machine gun, mounted AA 20mm canon and recoilless rifle. (reskin + new models for the weapons)
-Land Rover armed with: machine gun and recoilless rifle. (reskin or new model)
-French P4 for technical jeep. (reskin)
-Chinese middle truck for transport or armed with mounted AA 20mm canon. (new model)
-BMR and all the bunch of russian APC/armored vehicles available in PR. (reskin)
-French AML-90. (new model)
-Russian T-55. (reskin)

Aircrafts: African armies get really few aircrafts. They should be almost unrespawnable!
-Alouette (new model)
-Gazelle (reskin) or German BO (new model)
-Puma (new model) or Super Frelon (reskin)
-Mi-24 hind(reskin)
-Old mig (EoD model, reskin)

[Anhkhoa]

Originally Posted by [R-CON]162eRI

REALITY:
The big idea is to make two different "armies" in the same faction ingame. They will look different, the conventional army with the Post-US Vietnam equipment (helmet, green uniforms with some camo equipments, officer with green beret) and the commandos with new equipments (red beret, camo uniforms and even M88 "fritz" helmet if they feet on EoD player class models)
-Ground forces: Officer (AK), Rifleman (AK), Support (RPK), Grenadier (AK & lot of grenades), Engineer (AKs), Medic (AKs), Rifleman AT (RPG), Marksman (AK+scope), Collaborator (AKs)
-Commandos: Officer (G3), Specialist (G3+scope), Rifleman (G3), Support (PKM), Grenadier (AK+UGL), Medic (FAL), Rifleman AT (Karl Gustav), Sniper (Dragunov).

Vehicles
-Pick up armed with: heavy machine gun, mounted AA 20mm canon and recoilless rifle. (reskin + new models for the weapons)
-Land Rover armed with: machine gun and recoilless rifle. (reskin or new model)
-French P4 for technical jeep. (reskin)
-Chinese middle truck for transport or armed with mounted AA 20mm canon. (new model)
-BMR and all the bunch of russian APC/armored vehicles available in PR. (reskin)
-French AML-90. (new model)
-Russian T-55. (reskin)

That totally contradicted everything you have said in the before post......
Most of us were hoping the FN Fal would be the main weapon for this faction. Most factions have a particular weapon only for them.
Brits : L85
US Army : M4
US Marine Corp : M16A4
Peoples Liberation Army : QBZ-95
Russian Army : AK-74M
Chechan Militia : AK-47
Taliban : AK-74
Going for mostly AKs, few G3s, and one FN Fal wouldn't make the faction that unique. It would just be a altered PR v0.8 Militia that are pawns for the French.

Aircrafts: African armies get really few aircrafts. They should be almost unrespawnable!
-Alouette (new model)
-Gazelle (reskin) or German BO (new model)
-Puma (new model) or Super Frelon (reskin)
-Mi-24 hind(reskin)
-Old mig (EoD model, reskin

New mission for the French, much like how Big Red on insurgency heads directly for the Coalition main to take out 50+ tickets, the French send in a squad and snipe the planes with HATs and LATs...

[162eRI]

That totally contradicted everything you have said in the before post......
Most of us were hoping the FN Fal would be the main weapon for this faction. Most factions have a particular weapon only for them.

I know, I know, but really the FAL isn't used at all. I said that at first because I thought it was used...
I gave one to the medic just because everybody, me first, want it.
The G3 is used by many African countries.
Don't forget that they don't have military industries (except for Northen African countries and South Africa) and they only use what they can buy, means not that much modern... The AK is the African number one rifle!

Going for mostly AKs, few G3s, and one FN Fal wouldn't make the faction that unique. It would just be a altered PR v0.8 Militia that are pawns for the French.

Well, it's exactly what it is!
After speaking with some French Foreign Legion soldiers, African armies are kind of militia! Some of the countries over there, mostly old English colonies, get good armies (they can send troops for the UN peacekeaping op. for exemples!). But mostly, they are not, they have bad or old equipment and have bad officers with no training.

I will post some pix this week.
By the way, we should, if everything going fine, do 2 other factions. Altered PR v0.8 Rebells that are pawns for the French: Tchad Rebells and Somalian Rebells/Pirates.

[Cheesygoodness]

Originally Posted by [R-CON]162eRI

I know, I know, but really the FAL isn't used at all. I said that at first because I thought it was used...
I gave one to the medic just because everybody, me first, want it.
The G3 is used by many African countries.
Don't forget that they don't have military industries (except for Northen African countries and South Africa) and they only use what they can buy, means not that much modern... The AK is the African number one rifle!

See thats understandable, Though I admit I've found one or two West African countries that use the weapon. Honestly I've seen less of the G3 then the FN Fal. Sierra Leone it appears definitely uses the FN Fal. If you could supply what countries exactly are planned for the GGO then it would eliminate a lot of the confusion.

(Articles with photographic proof of the FN Fal in use in Sierra Leone.)
» Monday links 3/2/09 Drugs, Law and Conflict
BBC News | AFRICA | Sierra Leone hostage talks 'going well'
MWC News - A Site Without Borders - - Taylor boycotts Hague trial

I am also aware the Nigerian forces use the FN Fal which is a part of West Africa. I don't fully comprehend what this faction is from what you planned. Initially you stated it would be a conventional force if there equipment was a bit dated, however from how you stated your last comment that suddenly they won't be using optics and that a weapon that is in use in the area isn't in use.

I understand this is still in the development stages and thats why I am trying to give you decent backed up information, however you've shifted from the beginning plan to a more insurgent based force.

I don't mean to sound rude but it sounds like your not really looking into the current situation. Which is actually really understandable as you've done an amazing job and are still working on the French forces themselves and I don't expect superheros out of you guys.

I'll suggest before people get snippy or snide you remember that these guys have done amazing work getting to where they are now with the French forces and the fact they are undertaking another faction is more then a bit demanding.

And before you get put off by peoples comments 162 the way you presented it in your original post suggests its a coalition of armies even if using dated equipment they are still organized into an actual conventional force.

Originally Posted by [R-CON]162eRI

The OGG is like the MEC, a non existent faction made of different forces all around Western African countries. Mostly old French and English colonies.

To make a long story short, one of this country, with at its head a dictator, and its allies invaded its neighbors. They are now threatening the other countries around the Guinean Gulf to become part of their OGG.

So basically because I am getting really good at posting rather long comments on the topic.

Before we can get into more details and provide assistance or feedback as was suggest, a firmer grip on what exactly the force is going to -be- needs to be sorted out.