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Old 03-25-2017, 04:24 PM   #21
DogACTUAL

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Default re: 5.45x39 RPM

I don't get it. Why do some people want to turn this game into a modern Battlefield title with all the 'balancing'.

If you are going to change the behaviour and stats of a gun from the real values you might aswell stop using the model and make a model of an imaginary gun instead, like in COD infinite warfare. Why would you continue to use the M16 model and textures if it is nothing like the M16?

PR shouldn't work like that, PR has asymmetrical balance, even in AAS. What is next? Give thermal optics to the BTRs? If everything had to be perfectly balanced the DEVs would have to remove the insurgency mode too.
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Old 03-25-2017, 06:39 PM   #22
Frontliner
Project Reality Beta Tester
Default re: 5.45x39 RPM

Quote:
Originally Posted by DogACTUAL View Post
I don't get it. Why do some people want to turn this game into a modern Battlefield title with all the 'balancing'.
Because it poses a significant problem. Take the Hamas for example, if you're not taking the M16 if you have the option to do so, the IDF having Tavor and M4A1 coupled with better body armour means you're going to lose every engagement on equal terms. Similarly there is no need to use the M14 over it when playing USViet, so that totally undermines having an option for it.

Quote:
If you are going to change the behaviour and stats of a gun from the real values you might aswell stop using the model and make a model of an imaginary gun instead, like in COD infinite warfare. Why would you continue to use the M16 model and textures if it is nothing like the M16?
The entire point of the whole 900 RPM debate is exactly that they flat out aren't behaving like they should. It's almost irrelevant how little the 5.56mm NATO kicks, at 900 RPM you will be off target really fast due to - guess what! - recoil. Which the recoil cut-off prevents.

Let's put it this way: The values are close to their real life counter parts, true, but the game executes them in a way that leads them ad absurdum. There is no weapon system that wins over another in every type of combat but that is totally the case here and thus something needs to be done about that. Just like ATGMs got nerfed as soon as it was possible because they totally broke the armour balance for over half a decade and made modern NATO tanks vs the almost antiquated Chinese and Russian tanks and even their IFVs worthless tincans.

Quote:
PR shouldn't work like that, PR has asymmetrical balance, even in AAS. What is next? Give thermal optics to the BTRs? If everything had to be perfectly balanced the DEVs would have to remove the insurgency mode too.
We're not trying to mirror the factions here whatsoever.

RL C7 in full auto = noticeable recoil
Ingame C7 in full auto = Autowin in CQB

That is the problem.
900 RPM is the cause.
Nerf ROF unless you have a better solution.
Make AK74M great again.

ArkUTD: Do note this issue was resolved by the admin team and mats, thus this was closed
]CIA[ SwampFox: well my definition of glitching is using an enemy kit to kill the enemy
Para: You sir are an arse and not what the game or our community needs.
AlonTavor: that's like 5% holocaust there
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Old 03-25-2017, 08:09 PM   #23
sweedensniiperr
Supporting Member

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Default re: 5.45x39 RPM

I'd say git gud tbh. 1v1 ROF wins yeah. But it has nothing to do if your teams win or not. And that's the point of PR is it not?

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Old 03-25-2017, 09:29 PM   #24
[R-DEV]Mr.VdHeide
PR:BF2 Developer

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Default re: 5.45x39 RPM

Git Gud indeed.

The main disadvantage I see with the AK is it's scope, as said before that thing really doesnt handle well in cqb. So either someone (like me (hint huehuehue)) could make a new scope, or you just dont use it if you know you will be fighting in cqb. I tend to take the alt kits whenever I play Russian inf and even tho the enemy usually has better guns I really don't feel like the enemy has a huge advantage over me. To be honest, the way I see it all you need to compensate for the small advantage they have with their rifles, is a proper squad and a bit of tactic.

Quick example: You are on Dovre and you run into contact in one of those pine tree forrests. One of your squadmembers dies, he tells you where the enemy is. So what you do is you hit the ground, you find a tree, and you look for their feet. If you get the first shot you will win. Also, Russians get pretty good grenades which explode on impact. Yes, the German or the Dutch soldier has an advantage, but it is only small when you play it right.

I am always happy to see improvements in realism though. I have never fired a C7 whatsoever so I can't tell if PR is about right or if it is really not. ROF is just a fact we can google, but we cant get the spray ' 100% right'. The grouping depends on so manny things, I don't think I have to explain that. If we were to change anything then we should look into that, because there are no hard facts that would make it unrealistic to change the grouping a bit I suppose. I personally dont think it is actually necessary though. Also, that is a different topic, this is about if the AK should be improved. My thoughts on that: it could use a better scope.




D.J.

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Old 03-26-2017, 09:26 AM   #25
IronFist

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Default re: 5.45x39 RPM

Quote:
Originally Posted by [R-CON]Mr.VdHeide View Post
The main disadvantage I see with the AK is it's scope, as said before that thing really doesnt handle well in cqb. So either someone (like me (hint huehuehue)) could make a new scope, or you just dont use it if you know you will be fighting in cqb.
Well, good luck fighting with your iron sights against the Brits with their SUSAT and ACOG scope on Hades Peak or any other large map. Not only that, the Russians don't even binoculars to help them spot enemies from far away and iron sights suck against targets that are farther than 150m. Also, if someone can change the scope on that thing, why haven't someone done something? The Russian scope debat has been alive for at least 5 years (i checked) and yet no action was made. I understand the realism purpose, but can you at least make it so it doesn't block your entire screen like the ACOG or all the other scopes in the game?
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Old 03-26-2017, 09:51 AM   #26
[R-DEV]Mr.VdHeide
PR:BF2 Developer

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Default re: 5.45x39 RPM

Hades peak is not cqb at all. It is a large map with large forrest area's which are usually kind of open, there is not a lot of undergrowth for example. It is really not that hard to use the 1P29 there.

I agree on the fact we should get a new scope for the Russians though, which is why I am working on a new one.




D.J.

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Old 03-26-2017, 12:34 PM   #27
viirusiiseli
Banned
Default re: 5.45x39 RPM

Quote:
Originally Posted by [R-DEV]camo View Post
I think you very well know why that is, don't get too carried away all the time.
I actually don't, do tell

Quote:
Originally Posted by DogACTUAL View Post
I don't get it. Why do some people want to turn this game into a modern Battlefield title with all the 'balancing'.
Read this before further commenting please
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Old 03-26-2017, 03:27 PM   #28
DogACTUAL

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Default re: 5.45x39 RPM

Quote:
Originally Posted by viirusiiseli View Post
Read this before further commenting please
So what? I already said that the recoil might need adjustments, i just don't like the notion of changing the ROF because it defeats the whole point of PR imo.
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Old 03-26-2017, 05:20 PM   #29
Frontliner
Project Reality Beta Tester
Default re: 5.45x39 RPM

For the fifth time Dog, you cannot adjust the recoil by adding more recoil because that fucks up the weapons in semi-auto.

ArkUTD: Do note this issue was resolved by the admin team and mats, thus this was closed
]CIA[ SwampFox: well my definition of glitching is using an enemy kit to kill the enemy
Para: You sir are an arse and not what the game or our community needs.
AlonTavor: that's like 5% holocaust there
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Old 03-26-2017, 05:35 PM   #30
DogACTUAL

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Default re: 5.45x39 RPM

Yes, i understood that, however it would be preferable over changing the ROF.
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