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Old 11-20-2010, 07:38 PM   #21
Bazul14
Banned
Default Re: UH-60 Black Hawk

IRL it depends on the combatants and the ones manning the RPGs. If the shooter is high from cocaine or hallucinogens, then yeah, its hard. But IRL if the gunner is trained and knows his weapon, he can hit an enemy chopper. For example an Apache was hit with an RPG(NOT AA/ Strela/Stinger) during Operation Anaconda 2002, in the Tora Bora Mts.
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Old 11-22-2010, 03:56 PM   #22
Hunt3r
Default Re: UH-60 Black Hawk

RPGs can barely hit a still target at 500 meters away, why would it be able to hit an Apache at speed from as much as a kilometer away.


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Old 11-22-2010, 04:49 PM   #23
BloodBane611
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Default Re: UH-60 Black Hawk

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bazul14 View Post
IRL it depends on the combatants and the ones manning the RPGs. If the shooter is high from cocaine or hallucinogens, then yeah, its hard. But IRL if the gunner is trained and knows his weapon, he can hit an enemy chopper. For example an Apache was hit with an RPG(NOT AA/ Strela/Stinger) during Operation Anaconda 2002, in the Tora Bora Mts.
The fact that the apache was hit with an RPG says nothing about the difficulty of the shot, the skill of the shooter or the general ease of hitting moving aircraft with RPGs. It simply means that in one case, some shooter did in fact hit an apache with an RPG.

To address your original opinion on the damage to the blackhawk - the apaches that were damaged during Op. Anaconda all were able to RTB successfully. Here's a quote from the official AF report:

Quote:
The AH-64 Apache helicopters engaged in the fight all took damage. By the end of the day, four returned to the forward arming and refueling point (FARP), while three remained in action despite battle damage.
Quote:
AH-64 Apaches delivered fires but were damaged by RPGs and small arms crossfire
In addition, the MH-47 that was hit three times by RPGs made it 4 nm before it had to put down.

Quote:
One of two MH-47s was hit by three RPGs while attempting to re-insert the team, damaging hydraulic systems...That first MH-47 made it about 4 nm north of the landing zone before being forced down with mechanical problems.
There was a second MH-47 downed by an unknown number of RPGs, however all its crew survived the initial crash.


Of course, none of these are about blackhawks. However, the general gist I get from this is that it is harder to take down a helicopter than you might imagine. A single RPG in the right spot might bring down a helicopter in a single round - but you might fire a dozen in the wrong spots, and do only superficial damage, or at least non-critical damage, allowing the aircraft to escape or even continue flying normally. In addition, the crew and passengers of both the MH-47s that crashed lived through the landings - something PR cannot reflect at this time. There are too many variables to reliably say that someone firing an RPG should down a UH-60 every time, or even a majority of the time.



In addition, I think common sense dictates that hitting a moving target at a distance of multiple hundreds of meters using an RPG-7 will be difficult even for a skilled shooter. That doesn't directly address the original point of this thread, but the fact is that a 500 meter shot towards a moving helicopter is a gamble at best.



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Old 11-22-2010, 05:41 PM   #24
Imchicken1

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Default Re: UH-60 Black Hawk

Leave it as it is I say. Maybe modify the critical hit area's but other wise it's fine

Quad AAs are not op. They're very restricted in the few places they exist, plus it's very easy to kill yourself while on one. Shooting one also screams "hey I'm over here!"


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Old 11-22-2010, 06:09 PM   #25
Bazul14
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Default Re: UH-60 Black Hawk

I know it is hard to know the difficulty of hitting a chopper with an RPG just from a single hit, but the account of the people from the ground for the Apache incident says that there was a certain RPG shooter that fired several shots before actually getting a hit. The RPG hit one of the rocketpods, and it managed to RTB even tough all the oil in it leaked.

About the Chinook, that one that got killed received a shot in the rear engine then it landed , after which it received a shot in the cockpit area, missing the crew, but rendering its weapons systems useless.

I know that modern choppers can take some good dammage, but shouldn't then the Abrams, for example, be invulnerable to frontal shots(except TOWs)?!
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Old 11-22-2010, 06:24 PM   #26
Bazul14
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Default Re: UH-60 Black Hawk

Also, I did not say that one can easily shoot down moving choppers in PR with an RPG. It is very hard to shoot something that is in the air, 400m from you with something that you can't know where it is actually aiming(deviation and the other thing). To shoot a moving chopper is almost impossible unless it is following the same pattern repeatedly, and if its going very slow( like for sniping). With the exception of ATGMs, choppers can't be precisely shot with AT weapons. Also, remember that I ignored in my argument the very low flying choppers, but even those are hard to hit if you are unprepared.
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Old 11-28-2010, 05:29 AM   #27
Operator009
Default Re: UH-60 Black Hawk

This is something i consider rather funny, if a little off topic.

So the BH Miniguns haven't been changed, except for the sound they make at distance (which sounds bad ass btw devs). The sound is so intimidating, in fact, that I see a CRAP LOAD MORE BH gun crews than i ever saw last patch.

Are people using the BH more as a gunship/support because of the new sounds?

If so, greatest mindf**k ever...
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Old 12-02-2010, 11:21 AM   #28
BenHamish

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Default Re: UH-60 Black Hawk

Sorry to revive an old thread, but how bulletproof are Kiowas and Blackhawks?

It seems that nowadays they are used mainly as airtanks, invulnerable to small arms. Yesterday the Mi-18 (cow thing, whatever it is) hovered over my entire IDF squad as we poured small arms into it from cover. It had a pop at us with it's .50 cal and then retreated. We moved into other cover, and it did it again, TWICE.

My fault, for not having the LAT or AA in my squad, I know.

Also, later on, I was in a squad defending a cache on an Ins map. The Blackhawk came in, hovered on the roof of the building the cache was in (taking fire), dropped C4, and flew off, detonating the C4 and taking the cache (to be fair though it was downed afterwards).

I have also seen numerous times the Kiowas on Karbala [?] royally taking the piss and hovering/swooping/being l33t over the Northern caches that appear. The just keep coming, and dodge all the RPG's (sometimes going vertical/swooping and zooming over the same spot.

Really, are they that invulnerable that the pilots aren't afraid of small arms?


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Old 12-26-2010, 07:00 PM   #29
BenHamish

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Default Re: UH-60 Black Hawk

Hmm revisited this thread to say that today a Blackhawk landed in front of me, 100m away, and dropped off troops. I smiled like a cheshire cat, and hit it slap bang in the engines with an rpg (from the top, I was on a hill).

It took off, did some rotations to put me off (i was actually reloading), and then flew around the hill I was on, and then [very slowly] did a victory lap so that it's minigunner could get me. I fired, don't think I hit though (the supression effect worked well on me).

Bit frustrating really. I thought he was royally taking the mickey..


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Old 12-26-2010, 08:01 PM   #30
Zoddom

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Default Re: UH-60 Black Hawk

you guys seem to think jsut because rpg causes a big boom it would destroy anything. they work the same way as HEAT rounds, they fire a small metal jet through the target. to down a black hawk you really ahve to hit the right spots and keep in mind that the "cargo bay" is a pretty big hole in the model....

I myself dont have any problems with 50 cals. to me, it seems most of the players just dont have the "aiming skills" (sounds a bit l337) with AA guns. on a Fh2 server some hours ago i had 30-5 stats with the challenger AA tank.
most of the players just dont aim far enough in front of the target. (correct english? lol i hope you undertand waht i meant)



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