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Old 02-05-2016, 02:04 PM   #11
[R-DEV]Mats391
PR:BF2 Lead Developer
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Default re: Attack helis physics, flares and missiles

Quote:
Originally Posted by viirusiiseli View Post
Ehh... Gonna rant a little bit first. This always happens. A change is made, said change doesn't work. Go complain on forums, get told it cannot be fixed/thats just how it is. When it worked before.
Not sure what you are on about. This dead-angle always was there and locking onto targets in that never worked.
Also just because it worked before it does not mean it is what we want. The change to reduce turn rates was made to make the uav-style (like rabbit pointed out) of using choppers less effective. At that it was highly successful as we can see here


Mineral: TIL that Wire-guided missiles actually use wire
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Old 02-05-2016, 02:43 PM   #12
PatrickLA_CA

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Default re: Attack helis physics, flares and missiles

Well why don't you just remove attack helicopters then?
They have been nerfed to oblivion which makes them extremely unrealistic. They are slower than an APC, fragile as a civilan car, and now you have to be flying low and looking directly at your target to hit them.

The only way an attack helicopter can still be useful against the enemy now is when the enemy is very dumb and can't hit the helicopter.

In a best case scenario the helicopters are to be used from distance where the enemy can't hit them with anything but SAMs such as IRL but we all know that can't be done in PR because of the view distance limitations which now makes the CAS pilots fly lower and slower in order to hit their target which needs to be hit directly.

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Old 02-05-2016, 02:43 PM   #13
Aleon
Default re: Attack helis physics, flares and missiles

Did you try turning the helicopter towards the target?

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Old 02-05-2016, 03:36 PM   #14
viirusiiseli
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Default re: Attack helis physics, flares and missiles

Quote:
Originally Posted by [R-DEV]Mats391 View Post
Not sure what you are on about. This dead-angle always was there and locking onto targets in that never worked.
Also just because it worked before it does not mean it is what we want. The change to reduce turn rates was made to make the uav-style (like rabbit pointed out) of using choppers less effective. At that it was highly successful as we can see here
You replying with stuff about the dead angle when the whole point is not about that, and saying it's not possible to change, as if that would somehow carry to the missile agility. That's what I'm on about.

You dont look closely enough at the video, which shows it's not about the dead angle but just about the missile not turning. The missile didn't go straight as would happen by shooting in the dead angle, like you suggested.

And the whole thing about removing angled attacks.. Why? It's not even the most effective way to engage. Is that supposed to be a nerf? Reducing turn rate of the missiles just for this purpose doesn't even make sense, since it makes any engaging style bad because the missiles dont turn fast enough for low-vd maps.

You're either using false points or playing stupid intentionally to not understand the point of the thread.

Though I'm pretty sure I'm just being trolled now so I'll stop posting.
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Last edited by viirusiiseli; 02-05-2016 at 03:42 PM..
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Old 02-05-2016, 04:05 PM   #15
[R-DEV]Mats391
PR:BF2 Lead Developer
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Default re: Attack helis physics, flares and missiles

Quote:
Originally Posted by viirusiiseli View Post
You replying with stuff about the dead angle when the whole point is not about that, and saying it's not possible to change, as if that would somehow carry to the missile agility. That's what I'm on about.
Quote:
The second one might have been shot too far to the side. There is an issue with the missiles that no turn rate can fix.
I just suggested that it it might have been dead-angle. The trail could also have been from 1 shot. The video is shaky and hectic at that point, so hard to keep track. Nowhere did i say that it was or that having it turn is not possible. You are taking my words about un-fixable dead-angle and thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by viirusiiseli View Post
You dont look closely enough at the video, which shows it's not about the dead angle but just about the missile not turning. The missile didn't go straight as would happen by shooting in the dead angle, like you suggested.
Watched it again and i see the explosion in front of tank now. So yes, no dead-angle here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by viirusiiseli View Post
And the whole thing about removing UAV-style flying... Why? It's not even the most effective way to engage. Reducing turn rate of the missiles just for this purpose doesn't even make sense, since it makes any engaging style bad because the missiles dont turn fast enough for low-vd maps.
It is the most annoying to be on receiving end. Having chopper above you constantly raining death is no fun. When the chopper keeps making attack runs similar to jets it is less frustrating as it leaves some room to breath and re-position. From my experience attacking targets in front you is not really a problem.
It also makes it rather hard to kill a chopper despite him being almost stationary. This kind of attack is often ended by guided AT or auto-cannons instead of AA. Both are not available to IDF on Beirut making it a prime example where this can be frustrating.
I guess another approach would be to increase damage of things like 50cals vs choppers and decrease effectiveness of flares w/o moving.


Mineral: TIL that Wire-guided missiles actually use wire
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Old 02-05-2016, 04:08 PM   #16
[F|H]Zackyx
Default re: Attack helis physics, flares and missiles

Quote:
Originally Posted by [R-DEV]Mats391 View Post
The change to reduce turn rates was made to make the uav-style (like rabbit pointed out) of using choppers less effective. At that it was highly successful as we can see here
Viirus dont bother those limitation have been introduce to the game by design its not an accident as mats stated above.

Here we are again, trying to remove a "realistic play style" (uav-style) because of game play reasons.

In real life apache have been known to hover for extended period of time when they cant afford the luxury of orbiting around their target Gulf war, Operation Decisive Storm ...

Some videos the show that the UAV style is "realistic".



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Old 02-05-2016, 04:38 PM   #17
Wadziu

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Default re: Attack helis physics, flares and missiles

Here we go, another turn of our top beloved PR CAS whores on buffing their favorite fraging machine How about we also buff my favorite AA systems to realistic values so that I can erase you before you even come in range of your Hellfire missileses?
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Old 02-05-2016, 04:46 PM   #18
[F|H]Zackyx
Default re: Attack helis physics, flares and missiles

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Originally Posted by Wadziu View Post
Here we go, another turn of our top beloved PR CAS whores on buffing their favorite fraging machine How about we also buff my favorite AA systems to realistic values so that I can erase you before you even come in range of your Hellfire missileses?
Buffing ? right, look at the changes since .98...

But its really funny how those changes became more and more personal, 1 individual infantry player making you go out of your way to change deviation, prone firing delay ... And 3/4 cas players making you overhaul the CAS assets every patch.

I have to say i'm quite proud.
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Old 02-05-2016, 04:47 PM   #19
viirusiiseli
Banned
Default re: Attack helis physics, flares and missiles

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wadziu View Post
Here we go, another turn of our top beloved PR CAS whores on buffing their favorite fraging machine How about we also buff my favorite AA systems to realistic values so that I can erase you before you even come in range of your Hellfire missileses?
AAs have long since been able to lock helicopters that do not see you. You can see the lock BVR. I suggest you actually go play and try it out. Especially AAVs can fire at helis about 50-200m before they see him depending on the map. Do I have to make you a tutorial video?


Quote:
Originally Posted by [R-DEV]Mats391 View Post
It is the most annoying to be on receiving end. Having chopper above you constantly raining death is no fun.

I rest my case.
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Last edited by viirusiiseli; 02-05-2016 at 04:56 PM..
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Old 02-05-2016, 04:47 PM   #20
viirusiiseli
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Default re: Attack helis physics, flares and missiles

edit: doublepost, remove
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