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Old 06-09-2012, 05:42 AM   #1
Intrepid

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Default Tactical Armoured Patrol Vehicle (TAPV) New for Canadian Forces

Ottawa company lands $1.25B armoured vehicle contract - Ottawa - CBC News

Textron Systems Canada Inc. will supply Canadian Forces with 500 new vehicles
CBC News
Posted: Jun 8, 2012 8:07 AM ET
Last Updated: Jun 8, 2012 6:40 PM ET

Malley Industries fights for defence contract

An Ottawa company has landed a $1.25-billion contract to replace the army's fleet of armoured patrol vehicles, federal officials announced at a military base in New Brunswick Friday afternoon.
Textron Systems Canada Inc. has won a contract to supply the Canadian government with 500 of its Tactical Armoured Patrol Vehicles, with an option for up to 100 more.Textron Systems Canada Inc. has won a contract to supply the Canadian government with 500 of its Tactical Armoured Patrol Vehicles, with an option for up to 100 more. (Textron Systems Canada Inc.)

Textron Systems Canada Inc. will supply 500 vehicles to the Canadian Forces, with the option for another 100, said Fisheries Minister Keith Ashfield, the Conservative MP for Fredericton, and Julian Fantino, the associate minister of national defence.

The first tactical vehicles are expected to be delivered in 2014, they told the crowd gathered at Canadian Forces Base Gagetown in Oromocto.

The fleet is scheduled to be fully operational in 2016.

The federal government says jobs will be created across Canada for skilled workers to build the patrol vehicles.
Improved protection for soldiers

The Tactical Armoured Patrol Vehicle (TAPV) is an updated model of the one Textron's parent company currently produces for the American military.

The TAPV is specifically designed to protect soldiers from land mines and improvised explosive devices (IEDs) ? major causes of death for Canadian soldiers in Afghanistan.

'It has sustained 10 kilograms of explosive under the wheels and eight under the hull. So it makes it extremely resilient to IEDs.'?Major Carl Gendron

Fantino believes the upgraded vehicles will give soldiers a greater sense of security.

"We have learned many lessons through our combat operations in Afghanistan, one of which being the importance of armoured vehicles in protecting our soldiers from today's threats in operations," he said.

Major Carl Gendron, one of the experts who evaluated the four competing bids for the contract, said the TAPV is a tough vehicle.

"It has sustained 10 kilograms of explosive under the wheels and eight under the hull. So it makes it extremely resilient to IEDs," said Gendron.

The TAPV, which has a weapon system that's controlled from inside the vehicle, will replace the Coyote reconnaissance vehicles and an armoured vehicle called the RG-31.

Of the 500, about 200 will be used as reconnaissance vehicles, while the remainder will be personnel carriers.

The TAPV can, however, be reconfigured for various roles, said Brigadier-General Chris Thurrott.

"One of the interesting things about this contract are the packages that have been put in place to allow for replacements, to allow for adjustments," he said.

"So what you have is a pool of specialist equipment, some which is already prepared for vehicles for specific roles and other ones that will allow us to adjust."
New Brunswick company loses bid

Dieppe's Malley Industries was one of four other bidders who were beat out by Textron Systems Canada.

Malley had partnered with a U.S. firm, Force Protection, to bid on a $1-billion contract to build 750 armoured military vehicles for the Department of National Defence.

Force Protection designed the patrol vehicles, while Malley hoped to assemble them.

"It's one of those things," said Steen Gunderson, general manager of Malley Industries. "We're looking for the region to grow. We're looking for sectors such as this to grow, and today, unfortunately, is a sad day."

The company said winning that contract would have meant 120 new jobs and as many as 500 others through spinoff work.

"Support industries, supply chain industries would have seen significant benefits," he said.

Malley Industries congratulated Textron on its success. Gunderson said Malley's involvement in the bid was a positive experience because they were able to make connections with a number of big companies such as Lockheed Martin and Elbit.

"We've got some alliances there that we put a lot of sweat and time into these things, and I think these relationships will grow as well."



Mmmmm... indigenous arms production. These will be sweet as replacements for our recce vehicles too. I can already envision it with the mast.

TAPV reminds me of the German "TpZ Fuchs" (commonly pronounced 'tap-zee') and bears more than a passing resemblance to that wheeled IFV. It incorporates the finer lines of the Mastiff and the Nyala while still maintaining a stance like an HMMWV, mass like a Vodnick and profile of a slightly larger BRDM. I'm sceptical about the claims of blast resistance as 8-10kg doesn't sound like a lot of explosives. Mine resistant, ambush protected: yes, IED resistant, bomb-rated, not so much.

This seems like a suitable replacement for much of our aging fleet of vehicles. On the other hand, I can't help but wonder if the $1.5bn price simply isn't just too good to be true. Procurement will probably run into a snag or two along the way with some unforeseen expenses wrapped up in that pricetag. I guess I don't trust our current government not to screw up the purchase somehow.


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Old 06-09-2012, 10:09 AM   #2
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Default Re: Tactical Armoured Patrol Vehicle (TAPV) New for Canadian Forces

Its got tactical in the name, must be good. (:


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Old 06-09-2012, 12:50 PM   #3
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Default Re: Tactical Armoured Patrol Vehicle (TAPV) New for Canadian Forces

tacti-cool
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Old 06-09-2012, 02:25 PM   #4
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Default Re: Tactical Armoured Patrol Vehicle (TAPV) New for Canadian Forces

Looks like a derivative of the Cadillac-Gage (now Textron Marine and Land Systems) Commando, like the M1117 ASV.
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Old 06-09-2012, 06:33 PM   #5
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Default Re: Tactical Armoured Patrol Vehicle (TAPV) New for Canadian Forces

Fairly logical choice of vehicle. We need something heavier than a G-Wagen and lighter than a LAV (though I'm dubious it, like most other vehicles in its class, would be of much use against IEDs). Still awaiting the choice for the Close Combat Vehicle.


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Old 06-09-2012, 09:12 PM   #6
[R-DEV]Ninja2dan
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Default Re: Tactical Armoured Patrol Vehicle (TAPV) New for Canadian Forces

Quote:
Originally Posted by Intrepid View Post
I'm sceptical about the claims of blast resistance as 8-10kg doesn't sound like a lot of explosives. Mine resistant, ambush protected: yes, IED resistant, bomb-rated, not so much.
That's actually quite a bit of explosives. For comparison, the M107 155mm HE artillery shell contains around 7 kg of high explosive (Comp B). And most improvised devices, even those using a slightly higher volume of explosive material, are not designed as efficiently and often produce a much weaker blast. From what I've seen, most "large" IED's will only be packing around 5 kg of effective material on average, with 8-10 kg being on the higher and less-likely end of the scale.

Also, stating the charge size that the vehicle could withstand doesn't really convey as much about protective abilities. In order to fully understand the effectiveness, one needs to review test data and testing specifics.

Things like: Was the vehicle moving during detonation? If so, what speed? What composition of explosive material was used? Was the device buried? If so, how deep and in what type of base (asphalt, concrete, dirt)? Is that survivability rating for life expectancy of the occupants? Or is it based on survivability/mobility of the vehicle?

And in many cases, and AT mine is more likely to cause damage to the vehicle than a simple IED. Shaped charge > Blast wave.

Quote:
This seems like a suitable replacement for much of our aging fleet of vehicles. On the other hand, I can't help but wonder if the $1.5bn price simply isn't just too good to be true. Procurement will probably run into a snag or two along the way with some unforeseen expenses wrapped up in that pricetag. I guess I don't trust our current government not to screw up the purchase somehow.
Because it's mostly just an upgraded version of an existing platform, development and production costs will be much lower than something that was a new design. And Textron (CG) has a great history, so I don't think there will be many "snags" along the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by [R-DEV]Eddie Baker View Post
Looks like a derivative of the Cadillac-Gage (now Textron Marine and Land Systems) Commando, like the M1117 ASV.
Yep, the TAPV is pretty much just an "upgraded" version of the MSV, which was an upgraded version of the ASV, which was a newly-designed vehicle closely based on their old V-150 series.


I'd love to take one for a drive, oh well.


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Old 06-10-2012, 02:19 AM   #7
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Default Re: Tactical Armoured Patrol Vehicle (TAPV) New for Canadian Forces

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Originally Posted by Intrepid View Post
Of the 500, about 200 will be used as reconnaissance vehicles, while the remainder will be personnel carriers.

The TAPV can, however, be reconfigured for various roles, said Brigadier-General Chris Thurrott.

"One of the interesting things about this contract are the packages that have been put in place to allow for replacements, to allow for adjustments," he said.

"So what you have is a pool of specialist equipment, some which is already prepared for vehicles for specific roles and other ones that will allow us to adjust."
Seems like they want it to be similar to the US Army's Stryker. Highly mobile, protected and conform to a lot of battlefield roles.


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Old 06-10-2012, 03:50 PM   #8
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Default Re: Tactical Armoured Patrol Vehicle (TAPV) New for Canadian Forces

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Seems like they want it to be similar to the US Army's Stryker. Highly mobile, protected and conform to a lot of battlefield roles.
*Cough* Or the LAV III platform, upon which the Stryker is designed, which the Canadian Forces have been using since 1999. *cough*

The recce version will probably be something of a fennek, although the fennek doesn't provide such IED protection as this vehicle would.


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Old 06-13-2012, 11:10 PM   #9
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Default Re: Tactical Armoured Patrol Vehicle (TAPV) New for Canadian Forces

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*Cough* Or the LAV III platform, upon which the Stryker is designed, which the Canadian Forces have been using since 1999. *cough*
Which is based off the Swiss MOWAG Piranha.


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