Sunset City idea (Improvement)

[Anxiety]

Ever since sunset city has had its revamp it has had alot of mixed emotions , some people love the idea of massive cap area and less directed fighting .

Some hate the idea that once one side caps it they just rape the other team ,

My Idea is keep the massive cap radius, but split it up into 4 Flags of the city and make those cap radius' overlap ( make them very large) , this way , the fighting is still undirected , but one team doesn't get rapped when they loose one flag.

Ideas??

[darkNight]

Don't get the point.

I like it how it is right now. I couldn't notice any 'raping'. It's a great fight inside that town. Way better than the last version of this map.

[mammikoura]

I think what the OP means is that right now when you cap the city flag the other team starts bleeding. And to be honest, as long as one controls the flag they are going to win because the other team is bleeding.

But I don't see anything wrong with this. The whole point of the map is to take control of the city so obviously the team in control should be winning.

[Jonny]

But it should be reinforcement based, not flag based. If you hold the flag you are defending, there is your advantage.

[ReaperMAC]

There shouldn't be a bleed. Period. The flag radius and the cap time should be increased also.

[mammikoura]

Originally Posted by ReaperMAC

There shouldn't be a bleed. Period.

once the bleed is removed neither side has any reason to attack. However this won't stop the blue mob from running straight at the enemy and getting annihilated in the city. So yeah, it might actually work.

But I fear that at some point players start to realize that attacking serves no purpose anymore (this actually is true in many maps) and the game will turn into a camping party. No ticket bleed = no reason to attack. No ticket bleed = k/d ratio is all that matters.
All you need to do is defend one flag and wait for the enemy to rush towards you, then just shoot them. Positive k/d ratio to almost every player is guaranteed and you will win the round.

[Jonny]

Well it really does need to be as big as it currently is, there should also be a big bonus in tickets if you cap the flag back so it is worthwhile doing it instead of giving up.

There is also no reason to attack the enemy IRL if you are defending somewhere because it is safer to defend. So people really shouldn't be attacking when they hold the city.

PS.
IRL it is the k/d ratio that matters, kill the enemy and DONT die in the process. Its actually so important that it is well worth pulling back to save peoples lives if fighting gets too intense. Dying is the one thing you really do not ever want to do in combat, or at any other time.

[mammikoura]

Originally Posted by Jonny

There is also no reason to attack the enemy IRL if you are defending somewhere because it is safer to defend. So people really shouldn't be attacking when they hold the city.

yes but if you remove the ticket bleed then there is no point to leave the main base. Just set up good defences around the main base, use the rivers to your advantage and you will always win the round.

Originally Posted by Jonny

IRL it is the k/d ratio that matters, kill the enemy and DONT die in the process. Its actually so important that it is well worth pulling back to save peoples lives if fighting gets too intense. Dying is the one thing you really do not ever want to do in combat, or at any other time.

Yes obviously you don't want to die IRL. But IRL you want to complete your objective.. and even if you don't someone who has a higher rank will order you to complete that objective. (in this case, capture the city) If keeping the soldiers alive would be the only thing that people think about then there wouldn't even be wars, it's the objectives that the guys with the high rank are interested in.

Picture sunset city as a real life battlefield. Both armies have the objective of securing the city. So.. would they go to the city and try to secure it, or would they hang around drinking coffee in their base?

And finally, this is a game and it's ment to be fun. Usually servers have no problem with squads not attacking, but this is simply because about 95% of the players aren't that smart. (no offence) There are some maps where attacking is good, but on most maps it's a solid defence that wins.

[ReaperMAC]

Originally Posted by mammikoura

once the bleed is removed neither side has any reason to attack.

Not true, if you are able to get on their main flag, because you've capture the city, you can end the round in your favor. Not to mention TG already removed the bleed from the map (which makes it more fun and offers bigger firefights in the city). Going by this, I agree to what they have done to make the map more appealing and exciting.

The reason I say remove the bleed is because at this point, the Chinese, 8/10 times, will most likely grab the flag and the entire map is over. It is extremely hard to get the flag back, and by the time you do it, it is too late. But if you remove said bleed, the area would be more contested. Why bother playing PR if you can just sit back... and do nothing?

[mammikoura]

Originally Posted by ReaperMAC

Not true, if you are able to get on their main flag, because you've capture the city, you can end the round in your favor.

well that's true. But still you don't get anything from taking the city flag. You need their main base too.

Originally Posted by ReaperMAC

Why bother playing PR if you can just sit back... and do nothing?

exactly. And this is the exact reason why I'm worried about these maps where it's extremely hard to accomplish ticket bleed.

IF players realize the advantages of defence the whole game will change. This might not happen in public servers since well.. it's the internet, can't expect people to be smart. For example OGT, why push across the river and lose tickets when you can sit comfortably in cover around the flag on your side of the river and pick of enemies one by one as they try to cap the flag?

I've done this with my squad a few times. Just take position around north bridge (as brits) and wait till the chinese walk right into your sights. Kill them all, repeat untill you have won the round. We have done this I think 3 or 4 times, and usually in the end of the round the squad has maybe 50 kills and about 15 deaths. That's automatically 35 tickets for the team.

This also happened on a much larger scale on OGT in the tournament. No one even tried to cross the river because it was suicide against an organized defence. So both sides sat there shooting each other over the river for a few hours. Very fun indeed.

Another example from a tournament. Qwai river. We (as usmc) attacked and got fishing village, we continued to attack and got estate. We still continued to attack but were unable to get local tempel since the PLA had an awesome defence in therer. Result, usmc lost. We had 2/3 of the flags and we still lost. Not because we were worse players, but because the PLA were smarter and chose to defend.

Ticket bleed is needed to encourage people to attack, this might not be a big deal on a random public server but once you have 2 organized teams people are going to defend because that's how you win.