Suggestions to improve Insurgency.

[Dv83r]

Well I just finished a round of Insurgency on Al Basrah and I played as a Collaborator the entire time. I was the ONLY Collaborator on the Insurgent side until the last five minutes. Another person became a Collaborator in a different squad five minutes up to the end. I died four times the entire round. My first two deaths were due to an APC not paying close attention when I was standing out in the open. Take note he did not even attempt to classify me as a Collaborator but outright killed me. The next time I died was due to a Sniper about 150 meters away. I was standing out in the middle of the street trying to spot him with my binoculars. He took the shot and I died as a Martyr. The last time I died was an error on my end. I accidentally selected epi-pen and a British soldier shot me from across the river. One of the tactics I used was ambushes to British infantry. One of my squad mates would grab a shotgun and I would go around corners baiting small squads to chase me. We took down five enemy soldiers using these tactics until the end of the round. They finally got smart and didn't chase me down, but they attempted to use their specialist to take me down with a shotgun which I luckily survived and escaped to heal myself. Some of these simple things I just mentioned could easily been avoided by the BLUFOR side if they would respect the Collaborator.

[Dev1200]

What you are actually suggesting is that people don't kill civilians.. and how to punish them by forcing them off servers or other ridiculous punishments. Sure, it's annoying when people are hurps and don't know the ROE, but as long as I don't have any civi kills, I'm happy. Which you should be too. But instead other people have to suffer because you don't like getting killed / Other people killing civis. (:

[frankwilliam]

civilians get killed everyday

Id say it would be more realistic to remove all the punishments and implement some kind of cover up system

[BenHamish]

Originally Posted by USMCMIDN

Well my point was the good guys lost because of the civi kills. They were a good team a very well stacked team and after the civi kills they simply did not get the intel needed to win and lost.

Fair enough - Usually (on PRTA) it seems that the Unknown caches are readily revealed/found out, and thus IP seems a bit irrelevant.

Also, good point about the Collaborator kit, forgot whao said it but yes, it is an Insurgent KIT - Not a Civilian.

As such I can accept that it's fine for Blufor to just mow down Civvys, it is basically a strategic choice. With this in mind though I do think it should be slightly more punished (in terms of making the game harder for Blufor)..

Note: I usually play Basrah, which it seems is easier than Falluja for Blufor. The more chance of a cache spawning in an isolated/open are on a map, the easier it is for Blufor.

[Dv83r]

Originally Posted by BenHamish

Fair enough - Usually (on PRTA) it seems that the Unknown caches are readily revealed/found out, and thus IP seems a bit irrelevant.

Intelligence markers are not required if you know what your doing.

Originally Posted by BenHamish

Also, good point about the Collaborator kit, forgot whao said it but yes, it is an Insurgent KIT - Not a Civilian.

Remember that it may be an Insurgent kit, but it is to represent a civilian when it's not. Therefore, it should treated as such until the Collaborator outright helps the Insurgency by going outside of the ROE.

Originally Posted by BenHamish

As such I can accept that it's fine for Blufor to just mow down Civvys, it is basically a strategic choice. With this in mind though I do think it should be slightly more punished (in terms of making the game harder for Blufor)..

I can't accept what isn't true in real life. Look at this ROE, FM 90-29 Appdx B - Guidelines For Rules Of Engagement. Soldiers are given ROE cards when going into battle so they know not to fire purposely onto Civilians.

[[R-MOD]Spec]

Intelligence is not required if you know what your doing.

*giggles*

As for the civie kit: I begin to think it might be better to either create a completely new system or get rid of it. I don't like the current collaborator kit.

[mat552]

The problem here is what do we replace it with Spec?

The idea was absolutely brilliant when it was first released, and still held out for a version or two after words.

The problem is, it's totally outdated, a relic from when there were still Apaches on Basrah and before. The ideas are sound, but the execution relies on a lot older game concepts than aren't really workable at this point.

I try not to complain too much without adding in a suggestion, and I do want to point out that there have been a lot of fixes attempted, we just haven't found the sweet spot yet.

[Dv83r]

Originally Posted by mat552

The problem here is what do we replace it with Spec?

The idea was absolutely brilliant when it was first released, and still held out for a version or two after words.

The problem is, it's totally outdated, a relic from when there were still Apaches on Basrah and before. The ideas are sound, but the execution relies on a lot older game concepts than aren't really workable at this point.

I try not to complain too much without adding in a suggestion, and I do want to point out that there have been a lot of fixes attempted, we just haven't found the sweet spot yet.

No, the question is should we replace it? The Collaborator is still workable it just needs some more tweaking to stay up to date with the latest version of PR. As you have noticed AAS has had many tweaks including the brand new one, http://www.realitymod.com/forum/f196...ck-routes.html. Why can't Insurgency have an overhaul?

[ComradeHX]

Originally Posted by mat552

You won't ever be able to force players to feel remorse or guilt over their targets in PR. It's a numbers game, pure and simple, no morality besides what we bring in. It's fun to roleplay, but only if everyone's playing by the same rules. If you, as a collaborator, do something absolutely retarded like play dance dance revolution directly in front of a tank, you're not going to last very long.

You know what make them not last long? arrest.

Is it in PR? Yes.

/discussion.
-----------------------------
Current insurgency is great...
If a tank or APC lacks anyone with a shotgun/restrainer inside(...not sure how it can happen...) then it deserves to lose intel and get blown up.

[Dv83r]

Originally Posted by ComradeHX

You know what make them not last long? arrest.

Is it in PR? Yes.

/discussion.
-----------------------------
Current insurgency is great...
If a tank or APC lacks anyone with a shotgun/restrainer inside(...not sure how it can happen...) then it deserves to lose intel and get blown up.

What if the tank doesn't care about intelligence markers or points and just kills the Collaborator out in the open? Even though the tank could of drove up next to the Collaborator and the driver could have hopped out and arrested the Collaborator. Points will not change people's attitudes.