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Old 12-22-2010, 07:28 PM   #41
Ford_Jam

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Default Re: Suggestions to improve Insurgency.

As Collaborator: Hold Medic Bag out, people still don't know the new ROE rules, die as martyr
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Old 12-22-2010, 07:36 PM   #42
BenHamish

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Default Re: Suggestions to improve Insurgency.

Yep, but even if not you WILL get hit by one of the unscoped .50s.

If they are trying to arrest you you're doing something wrong. Unless you're baiting..


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Old 12-22-2010, 10:36 PM   #43
Dv83r

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Default Re: Suggestions to improve Insurgency.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bromley View Post
I dont play as a collaborator simply because I like having a gun in my hand. And when i am collaborator 9/10 times they try to arrest me, not shoot me
The question is what are you doing that gets them to arrest you. If your obviously baiting, then you deserve to be arrested. Just like BenHamish said,
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenHamish View Post
If they are trying to arrest you you're doing something wrong. Unless you're baiting..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ford_Jam View Post
As Collaborator: Hold Medic Bag out, people still don't know the new ROE rules, die as martyr
It's sad that those people still kill you. They need to re-read the section about Collaborators in the manual.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BenHamish View Post
Yep, but even if not you WILL get hit by one of the unscoped .50s.
The .50 cals need to confirm their targets with either a spotter or using their binoculars. Last, I'm thinking about typing up some more suggestion tonight that I have come up with and will edit the first post when I finish.


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Old 12-22-2010, 11:35 PM   #44
Rissien
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Default Re: Suggestions to improve Insurgency.

Reading the manual has absolutely nothing to do with accidental civi kills. Sometimes you dont even know one is there. Especially if its a cache building, people are damned sure not going to just hold their fire just because they dont know if a civi is in there or not. Like the time i already mentioned with killing three civis inside the cache building. Id rather take the chances and keep everyone inside that building pinned while friendly ground troops move in than just leave them open to attack because they are using a civi's mere presence to keep me from engaging.

Playing as insurgents, like cardio *aka bromley* I too dislike playing as a civi because ive gotten arrested now and then and dont like the spawn, but for the most part get shot, and you cant always say its intentional because especially with iron sights you cant actually tell and people arnt going to take chances if it does happen to be an insurgent.

None of your suggestions nor your responses to my earlier post respond to my comments as well. Limited to one per squad or lack of offensive weapons will not end the throw away attitude. All they have to do is wait untill they are within ROE, and go run into the middle of a firefight, or infront of a vehicle to get run over, or even mortars. By your first part alone players would get kicked or even banned from servers merely because someone used the roe against them. Happens all the time when civis get in front of insurgents or in the middle of firefights to either get blufor to stop shooting and get killed by the insurgents who have no such restrictions or end up shooting a civi whos playing sheild but by the roe in game is still killed as a martyr. Its a game, some things you just cant work around.


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Old 12-23-2010, 12:52 AM   #45
Dv83r

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Default Re: Suggestions to improve Insurgency.

Before you respond back Rissien, take note these are basic ideas and they can be edited to deal with exploits, issues, etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by =]H[=Rissien View Post
Reading the manual has absolutely nothing to do with accidental civi kills. Sometimes you dont even know one is there.
Please elaborate more on your point of not knowing a Collaborator is there other than cache buildings.

Quote:
Originally Posted by =]H[=Rissien View Post
Especially if its a cache building, people are damned sure not going to just hold their fire just because they dont know if a civi is in there or not. Like the time i already mentioned with killing three civis inside the cache building. Id rather take the chances and keep everyone inside that building pinned while friendly ground troops move in than just leave them open to attack because they are using a civi's mere presence to keep me from engaging.
So it's required that your the one and only way to keep the Insurgents from attacking your friendlies? What about HMG support or smoke grenades? Your treating this as there is no other possible way to attack and suppress the enemy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by =]H[=Rissien View Post
Playing as insurgents, like cardio *aka bromley* I too dislike playing as a civi because ive gotten arrested now and then and dont like the spawn, but for the most part get shot, and you cant always say its intentional because especially with iron sights you cant actually tell and people arnt going to take chances if it does happen to be an insurgent.
What are you doing as a Collaborator that get's you arrested? It is easy to tell the difference between an Insurgent and a Collaborator. Check what they are wearing on their heads, any tactical vests, or check their hands. These visual clues should help you distinguish between the two.

Quote:
Originally Posted by =]H[=Rissien View Post
None of your suggestions nor your responses to my earlier post respond to my comments as well. Limited to one per squad or lack of offensive weapons will not end the throw away attitude.All they have to do is wait untill they are within ROE, and go run into the middle of a firefight, or infront of a vehicle to get run over, or even mortars. By your first part alone players would get kicked or even banned from servers merely because someone used the roe against them. Happens all the time when civis get in front of insurgents or in the middle of firefights to either get blufor to stop shooting and get killed by the insurgents who have no such restrictions or end up shooting a civi whos playing sheild but by the roe in game is still killed as a martyr. Its a game, some things you just cant work around.
This is true as those specific suggestions alone are not entirely going to stop that attitude. Some suggestions I'm working on now at the moment will help combat this attitude even more. When I finish and you combine all of them, it will be a potent mix.


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Old 12-23-2010, 01:07 AM   #46
USMCMIDN
Default Re: Suggestions to improve Insurgency.

I dont think you rly are understanding what ppl are saying... It seems you are watching this section like a hawk and just sticking to your suggestion w.o tweaking it up much.

Again accidents do happen. Getting killed because u killed a civi is unrealistic even if this resembles being arrested in the middle of battlefield during major operations which does not happen IRL like I said b4 an army is not going to stop everything just to arrest there own guy, this happens after if it happens at all, even then investigations take place days, sometimes weeks after the actual incident. If anything there should b ways where one could engage civis other then using the eppi pen like using their binoculars (symbolic of spotting) or certain radius of an insurgent (IDK if that is possible tho)...

Civis could b tweaked but id see why I should b killed when I accidentally killed a civi or kicked cause i accidentally killed 2. I know it would be a limited kit but it could happen.
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Old 12-23-2010, 01:25 AM   #47
Dv83r

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Default Re: Suggestions to improve Insurgency.

Quote:
Originally Posted by USMCMIDN View Post
I dont think you rly are understanding what ppl are saying... It seems you are watching this section like a hawk and just sticking to your suggestion w.o tweaking it up much.
Just edited the first post with three new suggestions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by USMCMIDN View Post
Again accidents do happen. Getting killed because u killed a civi is unrealistic even if this resembles being arrested in the middle of battlefield during major operations which does not happen IRL like I said b4 an army is not going to stop everything just to arrest there own guy, this happens after if it happens at all, even then investigations take place days, sometimes weeks after the actual incident. If anything there should b ways where one could engage civis other then using the eppi pen like using their binoculars (symbolic of spotting) or certain radius of an insurgent (IDK if that is possible tho)...
I'm trying to think of any other possibility. How about when a Collaborator uses a cell-phone to mark enemies?

Quote:
Originally Posted by USMCMIDN View Post
Civis could b tweaked but id see why I should b killed when I accidentally killed a civi or kicked cause i accidentally killed 2. I know it would be a limited kit but it could happen.
We can't really say what will happen until it is actually tested. Both you and I could be wrong on certain things and right on others.


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Old 12-23-2010, 01:31 AM   #48
Psyko
Exclamation Re: Suggestions to improve Insurgency.

Quote:
1. First, when a BLUFOR player kills a Collaborator outside of ROE, he/she will receive a private message warning him/her of not to kill Collaborators outside of ROE and to arrest them with either restrainers or a shotgun. When a BLUFOR player kills two Collaborators outside of the ROE, he/she will be auto-kicked from the server. If he/she rejoins and kills another Collaborator, he/she will be auto-banned for the duration of the round. Yes, this suggestion sounds harsh, but it will help curb people?s attitudes toward Collaborators.
I like it. but they'll never implement it.

Quote:
6. The Sapper kit needs to become a limited kit. This kit needs to become limited to one Sapper per squad. Instead of having the amount of explosives I mentioned earlier, the maximum is now 270 mines, 45 pipe-bombs, and 36 grenade traps. I?m pretty sure that not every Insurgent is informed in how to properly set mines, pipe-bombs, and grenade traps. Therefore, this suggestion makes much more sense than it does now. If this change were to be implemented, this would open up the ability for Sappers to be able to set more mine markers whenever they set down explosives.
good call. this would make the insurgency squad act more like other factions squads. its time to put al basrah type fighting to bed. it was fun when there were shitloads of RPGs to spam as a little break from the grind of the other levels. but now the other levels are all extremely balanced and interesting. Insurgency squads need their MG squad leader, civilian, riflemen and sapper. thats how it should have been from the start. with possibly optional grenade traps for some.


Quote:
7. Right now, caches can be blown up with one C-4, three incendiaries, .50 caliber bullets, APC's main cannon, tank's main cannon, etc. Caches need to be strengthened a little more too where they can not be took down by hit and run tactics. Therefore, to combat this certain play-style, caches need to be edited to be stronger where they can be taken down by 2 C-4s, 4 incendiaries, etc. This means that BLUFOR has secured the area and seized the cache.
If i had my way, caches would be indestructible to anything but 2 incendiaries. i dont care how they do it in real life. infantry need to solve the problems on the ground and the vehicles should be protecting them instead of firing in random windows.


good suggestions. I hope they are considered.


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Thanks for all the hard work PR team!
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Old 12-23-2010, 04:53 AM   #49
Dev1200

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Default Re: Suggestions to improve Insurgency.

@OP+Edits


You need to realize that collabs have less sprint then soldiers do. Even though they should have more, since they don't have to lug a good 50 pounds of equipment around with them everywhere they go.

Also, the point of collaborators is to subtle-y assist the opfor team by providing medic support, and becoming martyrs. Secondary is roping, distracting, etc. "kicking" or "banning" people is completely ridiculous. This is definitely not roleplay by adding civilians to the mix. It is to add another gameplay element. If people don't play by ROE, themselves and their team is punished, severely.


After reading through all these suggestions, they sound like ways to make insurgency worse, not improve =l Civis not using suicide vehicles, weapons. You have no basis on why or why not, just because is your reasoning.

And suicide vehicles have multiple seats for teh lols. Don't you like fun? Plus it's realistic. After all, misery loves company ^^


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Old 12-23-2010, 07:18 AM   #50
BenHamish

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Default Re: Suggestions to improve Insurgency.

So nobody who normally plays Blufor thinks it's ridiculous that it doesn't matter if you kill civilians (that's also taking into account the level of experience/skill of those posting in this thread - above average I would guess).

Well that explains why the kit is almost pointless. In many ways it would be better to spawn with a gun like the Taliban medic, and be done with it and useful to the team (rather than tallying up Martyr deaths because you falsely believe it hurts the other team).

Also, I never shoot civvy's because I tend to identify targets before I shoot. If you don't know what you're aiming at, don't shoot it - That's the point of the [rather unique] Insurgency Mode isn't it?

Insurgency mode is fundamentally broken.


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