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Old 10-07-2009, 09:44 AM   #41
HellDuke

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Default Re: Qwai River - GPO edit suggestions for v0.9

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLean View Post
<...> In my country we got 90% forest and we use tanks<...>
Correct me if I'm wrong but you have a specialy made tank for that terrain. It has a turret that doesn't turn.

I agree with tanks, but all I'm pointing out is that the US is simply to be given something to take them down with. More AT kits or something... Or like TANK=TOW count (so it wouldn't be 3 tanks and 1-2 TOWs).

And choppers are a no no. Didn't like it when they were there

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Yes I know the map is old, but that doesn't really matter now does it?
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Old 10-07-2009, 09:51 AM   #42
DankE_SPB
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Default Re: Qwai River - GPO edit suggestions for v0.9

WZ551A vs Stryker converts in ROFL situations, when they stand next to each other shooting infantry not caring about enemy APC
or another effective tactics against stryker: if it stands next to ditch\down slope, ram it to the side and it will die upside down, or if it next to water hit it so he sink in water
how its realistic?
the statement that Qwai is inf\light APC only is wrong, heavy vehicles have place to operate, have places where they dominate and places where it can be easily pwned by infantry, its not an open desert map, where you have no place to hide from heavy assets
Quote:
using TOW humve’s don’t work ether
its one shot- one kill vehicle, with guided rocket, very fast, and it protects its crew from 25mm autocannon(or am i missing something and HMMWV can withstand AP burst into its glass?) its very deadly if crew is not completely dumb
i remember round, where chinese just give up using APCs, because they could do nothing, we were spamming the chat with "what the TOW status, where is it?" and only silence in response, i know, its a fail of team, but is it realistic when TOW is able to kill APC even if it spotted it 1st? i mean, i put 5-10 AP rounds into it and it just turns and kills me, when goes ofr repairs

Quote:
Correct me if I'm wrong but you have a specialy made tank for that terrain. It has a turret that doesn't turn.
they also has Leo tanks, if you dont like his example, take a look at russia


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Old 10-07-2009, 10:13 AM   #43
Smegburt_funkledink

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Default Re: Qwai River - GPO edit suggestions for v0.9

Quote:
Originally Posted by DankE_SPB View Post
its one shot- one kill vehicle, with guided rocket, very fast, and it protects its crew from 25mm autocannon(or am i missing something and HMMWV can withstand AP burst into its glass?) its very deadly if crew is not completely dumb
Me and Colonelcool were using the TOW HMMVW a week or so back. We took about 2 blasts from the 25mm through the windscreen, during the time it took our enemy to do that, I had to swing the TOW 90 degrees, then kill them. We were both bleeding badly and I nearly died but the HMMVW was barely scratched IIRC.

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Old 10-07-2009, 12:28 PM   #44
[R-DEV]Rudd
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Default Re: Qwai River - GPO edit suggestions for v0.9

Quote:
WZ551A vs Stryker converts in ROFL situations, when they stand next to each other shooting infantry not caring about enemy APC
nah, stryker shoots the WZ gunner

WZ driver tries to push the stryker in to the river


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Old 10-08-2009, 09:39 AM   #45
RHYS4190

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Default Re: Qwai River - GPO edit suggestions for v0.9

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sgt.Smeg View Post
Me and Colonelcool were using the TOW HMMVW a week or so back. We took about 2 blasts from the 25mm through the windscreen, during the time it took our enemy to do that, I had to swing the TOW 90 degrees, then kill them. We were both bleeding badly and I nearly died but the HMMVW was barely scratched IIRC.
unless the team's really bad the chinese will alway's win, at least on my server.


What the Aussies do is get all the APC up at once and then chase after it, when they find it they all jump on it all at once and then kick the S### out of it might take one of them with it, but then it a APC the Chinese can afford to lose. then they just spend the rest of the very short round annulating the US side and because of the extremely long respawn of the TOW it very difficult for the US to get the ball back in there favour.

So really i don't see how the TOW is supposed to function at all, when the terrain is against it and it is completely out numbered
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Old 10-08-2009, 11:40 AM   #46
akatabrask

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Default Re: Qwai River - GPO edit suggestions for v0.9

I must say that with tanks, Qwai was probably one of the best examples of a asymmetrically balanced map (and one of the most fun) there have ever been.
Not only from a heavy/slow vs light/fast/agile point of view but the map also invited for a game play that suited it. You both had these wide open lands (now also with further view distance) allowing the tanks do dominate everything, but also narrow passages between these where you without much hassle could ambush the tank as infantry, making it fun for inf too. And even if people is used on tanks it doesn't have to mean that it has to be less inf engagement. Think "less is more". Also look at bf1943, that's 32(?) players and people say that don't see any noticeable difference to 64 players.

And saying that "US would never engage in combat/tanks without 1337 pwnzor M1A1s/a10s/whatever is just fail.
Who knows, Qwai might be a strategic point needed to be taken in an early point of the "war" but for some reason, heavy support might not be possible to get at that time, and the only force nearby is this small recon force. Just look at Generation Kill which, though beeing Hollywood, in fact is based on real events, they rarely had access to heavy support.

Same thing pretty much goes for Chinas tanks. Maby they didn't have something more suitable nearby than this mechanized inf/tank unit. It's these kinds of conditions that make a battle interesting, not an engagement where one team would have all the advantages perfect.
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Old 10-08-2009, 10:38 PM   #47
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Default Re: Qwai River - GPO edit suggestions for v0.9

Asymmetrical Symmetry, what a concept.

Me thinks that's what the mapper was thinking when he created Korrengal.


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Old 10-08-2009, 10:59 PM   #48
IronTaxi
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Default Re: Qwai River - GPO edit suggestions for v0.9

Quote:
Originally Posted by akatabrask View Post
I must say that with tanks, Qwai was probably one of the best examples of a asymmetrically balanced map (and one of the most fun) there have ever been.
Not only from a heavy/slow vs light/fast/agile point of view but the map also invited for a game play that suited it. You both had these wide open lands (now also with further view distance) allowing the tanks do dominate everything, but also narrow passages between these where you without much hassle could ambush the tank as infantry, making it fun for inf too. And even if people is used on tanks it doesn't have to mean that it has to be less inf engagement. Think "less is more". Also look at bf1943, that's 32(?) players and people say that don't see any noticeable difference to 64 players.

And saying that "US would never engage in combat/tanks without 1337 pwnzor M1A1s/a10s/whatever is just fail.
Who knows, Qwai might be a strategic point needed to be taken in an early point of the "war" but for some reason, heavy support might not be possible to get at that time, and the only force nearby is this small recon force. Just look at Generation Kill which, though beeing Hollywood, in fact is based on real events, they rarely had access to heavy support.

Same thing pretty much goes for Chinas tanks. Maby they didn't have something more suitable nearby than this mechanized inf/tank unit. It's these kinds of conditions that make a battle interesting, not an engagement where one team would have all the advantages perfect.

exactly!! thats the exact storyline that was in my head when I made the map..

it doesnt matter a piece of piss what each faction "should" have... what mappers are creating is storyline and great battles...where one side or the other has something heroic to achieve against all odds...the tanks for the PLA on qwai always created alot of tension for the "almighty" US...which I absolutely loved..


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Old 10-08-2009, 11:53 PM   #49
mat552

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Default Re: Qwai River - GPO edit suggestions for v0.9

Straight and simple, it's been said before, but it's worth saying again.
Qwai's entertainment value (for me at least) was in that unlike the vast majority of maps, the asset loadout was so different, and yet each team had such an equal chance to win only if they play by the rules their sides allow. If the US fought the Chinese war, they lost. No staying power versus tanks. If the Chinese fought by the US rules, they lost. Nowhere NEAR enough speed and agility to be in just the right place at the right time.

The games that were truely evenly matched in terms of team strength always ended in a draw, absurd luck not withstanding. It wasn't about who's hardware was better, it was about who played their strengths versus the other teams weaknesses. I don't see a lot of maps that reward that anymore on AAS. (Insurgency is entirely based on this, but thats a whole 'nother can of worms)

If the other faction had littlebird equivalents that held people and TOW stand ins, I would love that map just as much as Qwai before it fell to the axe. Interesting scenarios are more fun than straight up fights 9/10 times! (But that one time, if it's something like Kashan first was, back when it was new and no one was bored of it..... Oh man are those fun.)

Players might be hardcoded, but that sure doesn't seem to stop anybody from trying.

Any gamemode in which one team is guaranteed victory by not spawning is a bad gamemode, fix Insurgency.
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Old 10-09-2009, 01:20 AM   #50
Hunt3r
Default Re: Qwai River - GPO edit suggestions for v0.9

I'm fine with Qwai just getting some attack LB support.

At most, an Apache. Which is already getting close to overkill.
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