Complete civilian ROE revamp

[McBumLuv]

Originally Posted by wookimonsta

if you are sitting in an apc and see a building with 3 rpgs, you open up since letting them take aim is usually fatal. now if when i open up on that building hit a collaborator that is sitting around inside, then i shouldn't get punished should I?

You don't need to fire HE into the building. If you even suspect that there are unarmed players there, use your coax, it's there for a reason. RPGs can be hard to fire, and though they can aim at you and duck to settle the deviation, if you keep the suppressed and move around abit, they won't be able to track you.

Also, you can use range to your advantage. If you're around 200 meters out, they won't be hitting you if you keep them suppressed.

[[EC]DR.NOobFragger]

One important thing that civies need changed is their sprint. Since chasing them almost always leads to a trap, they should either be slower or have less sprint. Maybe like when they use their medic bag, it drains their stamina also. But most of the stuff you suggested is just too harsh on the blufor. I see civies try and jump on nades and be human shields all the time. With the changes you suggested I am sure I would see more of this. I agree with wookie, If I see a house with RPG's sticking out of it, I am going to pummel it with HE rounds regardless if there are civies in it or not. Better them than me.

[snooggums]

Originally Posted by [EC]DR.NOobFragger

One important thing that civies need changed is their sprint. Since chasing them almost always leads to a trap, they should either be slower or have less sprint.

They already have less sprint.

[[EC]DR.NOobFragger]

Originally Posted by snooggums

They already have less sprint.

Yeah, but its not enough, they can still run away and lead you too a trap. In all the time I have ever playing insurgency (since .5) I have maybe arrested 10-15 civies.

[Jazz]

I'd agree to that if you take away the medipack and epipens. Then give him 5 or so patches. The notion of an untouchable revive guy is kind of silly.

[badmojo420]

Good suggestions McLuv, i hope it becomes a reality. I really like the never allowed to be shot part.

[GreedoNeverShot]

Any person who heals insurgents, throws rocks at me, calls in mortar strikes on my buddies, and informs on me to the enemy, harbors insurgents, and tries to lead me into traps I would shoot in a heartbeat.
This doesn't address the running into enemy fire problem. 3 meters is nothing, and there will probably still be human shields.

False arrests are also a bad idea. They can walk over to our base, and can just roam freely? They could tell their entire team where our soldiers are, with no repercussions. They could walk into squads rallies freely, and noobs would be annoying as hell, and there would be nothing the coalition could do about it. Civis don't just walk up to US troops randomly without some stern words from troops.

I think the class should be abolished and the parts of the kit should be distributed amongst other kits.

Give the insurgents a medic and call it a day.

+1... but no epipens for the insurgent medic.

[Threedroogs]

collaborators get way less sprint, noobfragger. that definitely shouldnt be lowered, in my opinion.

i wonder if it's possible to force someone's spawn back to the main base. if you kill a collaborator outside the ROE, you get a longer spawntime and are forced to spawn at the mainbase on your next death (or when court martialed). that would certainly add to the punishment in most circumstances.

<edit> just reread the first post and i had missed something. i still think more insurgents should get hooks, though.

it would be interesting to have two classes, actual civis and collaborators. kill a civi and you're in for a horrible penalty...maybe 60 seconds added to your spawntime for each respawn for the rest of the map.

i love the feeling of having to check targets in insurgency mode, although more tweaking is definitely needed. the class should definitely NOT be scrapped for this one reason. i think the devs took a big step forward from .8 to .85.

[badmojo420]

Originally Posted by GreedoNeverShot

They can walk over to our base, and can just roam freely? They could tell their entire team where our soldiers are, with no repercussions. They could walk into squads rallies freely,

Those all sound like realistic things that could happen in the real world. So why not PR? The biggest hassle with fighting an insurgency is how the enemy mixes in with the civilian population. It forces the coalition troops to be careful about who they fire upon. They watch people, observe their actions and determine if that person is an enemy or just a civilian wondering around in a war zone.

In PR currently, no matter what actions the civilian is performing, he can be arrested on sight. With that, the whole idea of civilian, unarmed collaborator, etc goes out the window. You might as well give him a gun with no ammo. He is a target, that is to be taken down with less than lethal force. No thinking or observing is required on the part of the coalition. It's a very gamey part of the insurgency game mode.

Your comment about a collaborator approaching coalition troops is valid. But the problem is if a rule was put in, that any collaborator within 5m of a coalition troop is a valid and open target. Can you guess what will happen? Coalition troops will be running down any collaborator they see, getting within 5m, then boom headshot.

I don't think the suggestions McLuv are suggesting will make the system perfect and un-exploitable, but they're much better than the current system we have.

[GreedoNeverShot]

How is some random civilian running up to a US firebase and base realistic? They just don't say "Oh come on in!". You run up to US soldiers in a combat area without complying with them, and you will be SOS or arrested.

Civilians running around in the city, fine.

Civilians running and messing with US patrols and running up to restricted areas like US bases... NO. You know that will happen, and there will be nothing the US can do about it. Big bonus for US is that when nobody is around they can pop out their cellphone, call in a mortar, and switch back to unarmed and the US will still be under the impression they cant shoot him.

If there is a civilian running towards your FOB, how are you supposed to be telepathic and determine whether or not you can arrest him?