Flag Capture by Building Bunkers

[fubar++]

Just an idea:

A. To capture a flag you need to build a bunker (forward outpost) at flag radius.

B. To neutralize a flag you need to destroy enemy bunker (base too).

No more flag capture needed by troops, only build/destroy bunkers. Just think about it.



Edit:

UPDATE(2) TO THE SUGGESTION

Title should be "Flag Capture by Building "FCPs""


A. To capture a flag you need to build a "Forward Command Post" (it's just a name no need to stick with it) at flag radius.

B. To neutralize a flag you need to destroy enemy "Forward Command Post".

"FCP" would be some small object, like a radio on top of box you have now at firebases and bunkers, so it can be hidden reasonable well. Engineer class should be given small demolition charges (preferably timer detonated, like slams) to clear out possible defensive emplacements around the "FCP".

"FCP" should be able to be damaged by small arms fire (like insurgent caches), but it could not be destroyed. "FCP" would only get destroyed after certain delay if it is damaged. That would be required to prevent hit-and-run tactics for destroying "FCP" when the enemy don't actually have control of the area.

For building and repairing the "FCP" you would need to use the shovel. Order to build you would also need two supply crates, but maybe supply truck could be given more supply crates, e.g. 4 of them.

Most parts of the new requirements for game logic and other stuff are small details, but some parts might need a bit more redesigning.

[Celestial1]

1) There could therefore only be 4 flags on any map. You can only build 4 forward outposts anywhere.

2) Would not work on every map. Having to build a bunker in Kashan causes headaches for some people.

3) Command and Control is somewhat like this. Building outposts gives you a method of attack, and once you have 4 you go after the only enemy flag on the map, which is their main. If played tactically, it is actually a lot more interesting than your method suggested, no offense; It just leads to MUCH different strategy on maps.

[fubar++]

Originally Posted by Celestial1

1) There could therefore only be 4 flags on any map. You can only build 4 forward outposts anywhere.

You can change that, like no limits for bunkers but only 2 firebases.

Originally Posted by Celestial1

2) Would not work on every map. Having to build a bunker in Kashan causes headaches for some people.

Yes it's hard sometimes, but why should it be easy? And it would be same for both teams.

Originally Posted by Celestial1

3) Command and Control is somewhat like this. Building outposts gives you a method of attack, and once you have 4 you go after the only enemy flag on the map, which is their main. If played tactically, it is actually a lot more interesting than your method suggested, no offense; It just leads to MUCH different strategy on maps.

Yep, C&C is very similar, there's just no AAS - if you have it, flag capture would flow much like it does now, probably just slower.

The logic is very simple if you just replace troops by bunker. The outcome is you still need troops, but like in the actual role they are intended: setting defences and defending; attacking, locating enemy defences and destroying them. Now best way to cap a flag is just hide at flag capping area as much as you can.

Raising a flag is only symbol for victory.

[Safekeeper]

I don't see the reason for this, really. I mean, once you've killed or driven out every enemy on, say, a hill, you control that hill. No need to build a bunker there - there's no enemy presence, you have presence, you're in control. I see the reasoning behind this, but I don't really like the idea.

It'd be an interesting special objective or something, though, like a 'special CP' that requires you to fortify it before you can move on and capture the next, but I don't really like that idea either.

[GoreZiad]

Could be cool in some maps.

[fubar++]

Originally Posted by Safekeeper

I don't see the reason for this, really. I mean, once you've killed or driven out every enemy on, say, a hill, you control that hill. No need to build a bunker there - there's no enemy presence, you have presence, you're in control. I see the reasoning behind this, but I don't really like the idea.

It'd be an interesting special objective or something, though, like a 'special CP' that requires you to fortify it before you can move on and capture the next, but I don't really like that idea either.

It's up to you whether you like it not, of course. It's just at the moment flag capture battles are more like in guerilla wars: fast (mostly on foot) infantry attacks without any logistics. Usually conventional armys use loads of preparations before attack, and if defending, would never left positions unfortified somehow, even if it would be only foxholes or sandbags. And there's always logistics to resupply troops at line. If you've ever been in military service you would notice the difference(s) between the game and real army.

When I was in service there was a saying "your always busy for waiting", and what would better way to wait than dig yourself nice little foxhole

[fubar++]

To go a bit further with the proposed idea system could be like this: To capture a flag (which should have a relative large radius) you need to place bunker (let's call it like Forward Command Post). After establishing FCP you could deploy secondary spawn point (a firebase) in certain radius of FCP, but not necessarily at flag area, to represent your reserves. If your FCP gets overrun (knifed as it is now) and you loose the control of the flag you still would have your secondary spawnpoint order to recapture the flag, if it's not also overrun. Rest would same as it is now, with AAS and everything else. AAS could also control whether a bunker can be overrun or not at that particular moment.

Second point would be redesigning bunkers and firebases as smaller objects, e.g. radio on a table or something like that, order to hide the spawnpoint well enough.

[Fishbone]

Sounds good, but the bunker should not be a spawnpoint. One thing I hate about FOPs is the enemy soldiers popping out of nowhere when your squad is approaching it to knife the radio. With your proposed system this would become more common as the bunkers have become the main objectives.

[gazzthompson]

Originally Posted by Fishbone

Sounds good, but the bunker should not be a spawnpoint. One thing I hate about FOPs is the enemy soldiers popping out of nowhere when your squad is approaching it to knife the radio. With your proposed system this would become more common as the bunkers have become the main objectives.

i like that no spawn idea, more fair... how about two types of firebases normal ones (spawns) and "capture" ones

[fubar++]

Yes, separate spawnpoint could work too. So order to capture a flag you should make a "forward command post" or whatever, which you have to defend, and a "bunker" so that you can defend it. Maybe there still should be separate firebases left like there is now for tactical maneuvers.

Edit: Actually, maybe there shouldn't be a "bunker" at all, only "FCP" somewhere (well hidden) at flag, and you could place a firebase anywhere you think it is best, but not too close to the "FCP".