CAS pilots! Don't be afraid to...

[[R-CON]ChiefRyza]

Are you trying to get the pilots killed? Or do you blatantly disregard what it's like to be in a Jet on a 16km sq map, with no proper intel on targets or anti-aircraft. I hope to god I never get someone like this directing jets around on the server, because the way you talk about "calling in" CAS is quite literally, vehicle crucifixion. The reason, as many people in this thread have said, that we need co-ordinates for jets is that we want to be within the enemy AA range and visual range for as short a time as possible.

Your way of calling in CAS is selfish and you obviously couldn't care less if the jet dies or not, as long as you get your target down. Project Reality specifically designs the CAS system around ground intel, and the pilot has to rely on this information to be of any use. Ive had people call jets in and there has been AA in the immediate area, but hey..who cares about the jet? "We need this tank gone, screw your safety, kill it for us".

A jet can stay in the air for a very long time doing the opposite of what your asking them to do. Stay above the 1100ft AA lock ceiling, and only react to situations on the ground through very accurate markers and keypad locations, and you will be more use to your team than someone who just scoots around in plain sight, shooting things they see (which is pretty useless mind you). Your biggest threat is GROUND AA. This will clean you up in no time should you decide to re-enact a Vanilla game and fly around expecting to be invincible.

Searching for targets visually will result in you dying. I would go as far as saying your asset wasting if your doing this in-game, because obviously if your doing this your either:

1) Retarded
2) Stupid
3) Way too confident
4) Too much time on your hands
5) All of the above.


You want to get the target destroyed in the FIRST run. You can't afford to zoom around the one area over and over because guess whats going to happen....

[Wags]

Originally Posted by Dr2B Rudd

to who, a JTAC or commander?

I've honestly never heard the term JTAC, but I'll assume I'm talking to a JTAC as I never really talk to the commander.

[Wags]

Originally Posted by ChiefRyza

Are you trying to get the pilots killed? Or do you blatantly disregard what it's like to be in a Jet on a 16km sq map, with no proper intel on targets or anti-aircraft. I hope to god I never get someone like this directing jets around on the server, because the way you talk about "calling in" CAS is quite literally, vehicle crucifixion. The reason, as many people in this thread have said, that we need co-ordinates for jets is that we want to be within the enemy AA range and visual range for as short a time as possible.

Your way of calling in CAS is selfish and you obviously couldn't care less if the jet dies or not, as long as you get your target down. Project Reality specifically designs the CAS system around ground intel, and the pilot has to rely on this information to be of any use. Ive had people call jets in and there has been AA in the immediate area, but hey..who cares about the jet? "We need this tank gone, screw your safety, kill it for us".

A jet can stay in the air for a very long time doing the opposite of what your asking them to do. Stay above the 1100ft AA lock ceiling, and only react to situations on the ground through very accurate markers and keypad locations, and you will be more use to your team than someone who just scoots around in plain sight, shooting things they see (which is pretty useless mind you). Your biggest threat is GROUND AA. This will clean you up in no time should you decide to re-enact a Vanilla game and fly around expecting to be invincible.

Searching for targets visually will result in you dying. I would go as far as saying your asset wasting if your doing this in-game, because obviously if your doing this your either:

1) Retarded
2) Stupid
3) Way too confident
4) Too much time on your hands
5) All of the above.


You want to get the target destroyed in the FIRST run. You can't afford to zoom around the one area over and over because guess whats going to happen....

16km maps? I thought it was 4km.

That's why I ask if there is AA in the area. Refer to my previous post where I gave alittle step-by-step scenario of this tactic. I ask the groundie if AA is in the area. If not, I'm good to go. If there is, I will ask for it's appox. co'ords, and try and talk to friendly armor and see if they can take it out.

I'll also ask if there has been enemy jet sightings, and if so, where they were sighted. Did they drop bombs? Did the OpFor aircraft engage ground troops? What type of jet was it?

I don't see what you mean by me being selfish for using this tactic. Quite simply, the A-10's job is to support the troops on the ground, if your not doing that when you need to, you have failed as a CAS pilot. I would never fly my jet into an area that is too risky and when I have a greater chance of dying than surviving. I'm not saying I always use this tactic. This tactic was made because I, as the CAS pilot, wont always get my way. I wont always get my co'ords, or my lase. When the guy the ground is too stupid to do anything but ask for it to be killed, you need to improvise and kill it. This is not like real military operations, not everybody on the ground knows what to do. So you, as the pilot, needs to know what to do in any given situation. If you cannot do that, you have failed as a CAS pilot.

[alexaus]

ye but its 16Square 4x4

[Psyrus]

Originally Posted by Tophatter94

I wont always get my co'ords, or my lase. When the guy the ground is too stupid to do anything but ask for it to be killed, you need to improvise and kill it. This is not like real military operations, not everybody on the ground knows what to do. So you, as the pilot, needs to know what to do in any given situation. If you cannot do that, you have failed as a CAS pilot.

Nah, if you follow what you do, you are a MASSIVE fail CAS pilot, and I'd hope some nub gets the plane before you do. At least he has the excuse of "not knowing better" than you, who knows the proper way to do it yet ignores it for the sake of his own "fun" or kill ratio.

I could care less if you kill those extra 2 tanks, but if you end up dying and I need CAS 10 minutes later, you're the fail. ChiefRyza hit it pretty much on the head. I've seen time and time again people take this "scouting for targets" approach and I have yet to see them last out a round, whereas myself and others have kept planes up in excess of an hour (whilst maintaining 20-40 kills) by following the proper CAS tactics.

To each their own, but you'd get a decent earful were you to employ those shoddy tactics on a server that I'm designating targets on. I want my CAS when I need it, not some rambo fighter l33tz0rz A10 pilot who wants to 'keel all lolz'.

[Alex6714]

Originally Posted by Tophatter94

16km maps? I thought it was 4km.

That's why I ask if there is AA in the area. Refer to my previous post where I gave alittle step-by-step scenario of this tactic. I ask the groundie if AA is in the area. If not, I'm good to go.

Ok see this is the problem. AA range = 1200/1400m. View distance. = 900-1000m.

Hills = Break visual.

Therefor you can never rely fully on a groundie saying if there is AA or not.

[Wags]

Originally Posted by Psyrus

Nah, if you follow what you do, you are a MASSIVE fail CAS pilot, and I'd hope some nub gets the plane before you do. At least he has the excuse of "not knowing better" than you, who knows the proper way to do it yet ignores it for the sake of his own "fun" or kill ratio.

I could care less if you kill those extra 2 tanks, but if you end up dying and I need CAS 10 minutes later, you're the fail. ChiefRyza hit it pretty much on the head. I've seen time and time again people take this "scouting for targets" approach and I have yet to see them last out a round, whereas myself and others have kept planes up in excess of an hour (whilst maintaining 20-40 kills) by following the proper CAS tactics.

To each their own, but you'd get a decent earful were you to employ those shoddy tactics on a server that I'm designating targets on. I want my CAS when I need it, not some rambo fighter l33tz0rz A10 pilot who wants to 'keel all lolz'.

I never said I am ignoring any other method just to get kills. About those two extra tanks; I'm only killing them if I'm called in to do so.

It's not scouting for targets. I am NOT staying low for the whole time I fly. I'm coming down low to find my target, kill it, and popping back up into the safer altitudes. Besides that, I have done this low flying tactic repeatedly and have yet to be shot down by anything.

I haven't been shot down since I was a green pilot when even landing was a great challenge for me.

Im not being a general strike fighter. I'm only going low to find the target I've been asked to kill, and nothing more. I can do this without co'ords and a lase. I'm being an On-Call CAS fighter.

I will never forget what a guy said to me once, he said,"Your a kinda different pilot; you helped us no matter what." And that's what I do. I'll help my ground troops no matter what 'cause that's what I do as a CAS pilot. I've never been shot down and I've never done anything too risky.

[Rudd]

Guys, you can disagree with the man's tactics. Do not get insulting or offensive. If he can pull it off, fine. But lets put forward our opinions with respect.

Joint terminal attack controller - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

yeah, I'm sad to use the lingo tbh. It makes me sound savvy...or dumb.

I guess you were talking to ur SL on the ground then? that can work ok, I was confused cuz if u were talking on a teamwide net you'd be filling the net with chatter. its ok if it was in teh CAS squad though. Though such operators don't tend to work that well with teh PR spawn system.

[Oddsodz]

Oh my. If he was in the A-10. And I am on MEC. He would not last to long and that is a fact. My AA Gaskin would eat him up real fast. Fact.

[CAS_117]

Originally Posted by Tophatter94

Get your hands dirty! What I mean is get down low. Don't be afraid to do this! You'll be way more effective if you do this!

I know this has happened to all CAS pilots:

-BluFor Inf:"Hey air support, can you bomb my lased target?"

Of course in your scenario, you are not given co'ords. Do you need them? NO!

-Pilot:"Where is your lase?"
-Infantry:"Uhh...East of the North bunker."

(Yes, i've chosen Kashan Desert for my scenario)

Still no co'ords. Now I've seen most pilots just say,"I'm not bombing anything until I get co'ords," and I just think that is silly. With the info the groundie has given you, you can make a low pass to determine where the target is. Then come back around to kill what you've spotted. That's all it takes.

NO,"You need co'ords" replies. NO,'You need a lase" comments. It is in my opinion that the best pilots not only can get in the air, bomb accurately, and land. That the best pilots can do so in a choatic, confused enviroment in which info and time can be short.

You will also gain much respect among the ground-pounders. I know this. This is how I run CAS when I jump in the cockpit.

100% correct.