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Old 03-24-2009, 05:09 PM   #31
R.J.Travis
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Default Re: Can anyone explain why we capture flags?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Threedroogs View Post
you werent the only one to use the word camping...




i dont understand what that is supposed to mean. people who whine about 'camping' are basically complaining about someone using tactics and position and intelligence.


getting people to defend shouldnt be that hard. it's one the easiest way to guarantee your squad some action.
Camping and defending are not the same.

If your defending you are with in a flags radius.

If your camping your out side of a attack and/or a defense point camping the spot to cut off access off of the area camping and defending are tactic's and should not be looked down on.

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Old 03-24-2009, 06:36 PM   #32
Ace42
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Default Re: Can anyone explain why we capture flags?

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Originally Posted by Threedroogs View Post
i dont understand what that is supposed to mean.
I was just teasing you, don't take it personally. My point was that in most FPSs camping is viewed as a pretty cheap, juvenile, boring, and unsporting "tactic." From Doom, through to Quake, to the Unreal series; "camping" (AKA setting up an ambush near key items or terrain) is derided, even though it's effective.

In a lot of ways (for example the massive move-deviation which requires you to be locked in place to pop off accurate shots, rewarding campers) I think that a lot of the arguments for "realism" from the PR community tend to be a front for people who want to legitimise good ol' fashioned camping.

I mean, that's fine and all. There's no reason why there shouldn't be a game / mod orientated in such a way that it caters for people who are inclined to be campers - there's plenty of games out there for non-campers. It's just amusing that a big chunk of people here try and draw out from their personal preference arguments of "realism" and "rationality" and "teamwork" etc etc etc.

Man, that's always rich.

So yah, I was just teasing, but given how much subtle irony I crammed into a small paragraph, I can see why you asked me what I meant.
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Old 03-24-2009, 07:57 PM   #33
PFunk

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Default Re: Can anyone explain why we capture flags?

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Originally Posted by R.J.Travis View Post
Camping and defending are not the same.

If your defending you are with in a flags radius.

If your camping your out side of a attack and/or a defense point camping the spot to cut off access off of the area camping and defending are tactic's and should not be looked down on.
No I disagree. Just because you're not in the radius doesn't mean you're not defending. Many cap radii are restrictively small and in order to stay on them you lose tactical options. If it means cutting off an attacking party's approach by moving out of the radius it still counts as defending the point.

But yes it should not be looked down on. Think about it, you're attacking a defender everytime you take an objective. Someone has to defend or else there would be nothing but meeting engagements and they'd be few and far between.

I think camping is just a pejorative word used by unimaginative gamers who don't like the concept of their quarry actually being good. If you ever hear these people die its cause of cheating or someone else being stupid or in effect using an illegitimate tactic, usually one which takes advantage of someone's bumbling charge through enemies with no regard to his flanks.

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Old 03-24-2009, 08:37 PM   #34
Threedroogs
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Default Re: Can anyone explain why we capture flags?

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Originally Posted by Ace42 View Post
I was just teasing you, don't take it personally. My point was that in most FPSs camping is viewed as a pretty cheap, juvenile, boring, and unsporting "tactic." From Doom, through to Quake, to the Unreal series; "camping" (AKA setting up an ambush near key items or terrain) is derided, even though it's effective.
this is the view by a certain group of people who like to whine about everything. i have been hearing the 'he's camping' BS for the entire life of FPSs. it's this kind of attitude that is driving FPS development, unfortunately. that's why your average FPS players want to run at 30mph, jump off 10 foot walls unhurt and be able to take 7-8 "bullets" while running and shooting all at the same time. a lot of people find this style fun, i do not. turn it around...do you think it's fun for me to be in a much better position but still get killed by a charging enemy that i had the drop on? in the twitch games, strategy and position mean nothing. that's why PR is not for everyone. your average FPSer wants to run-and-gun.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace42 View Post
In a lot of ways (for example the massive move-deviation which requires you to be locked in place to pop off accurate shots, rewarding campers) I think that a lot of the arguments for "realism" from the PR community tend to be a front for people who want to legitimise good ol' fashioned camping.
this gets back to the root problem. 'camping' as you call it has always been legitimate. people just whined about being killed by someone who had a huge advantage against their blind charge. i can sort of understand complaining about 'camping' in games where you get one life like rogue spear where some guy grabs the sniper kit and sits there the whole round doing nothing, while all the other dead guys have to wait for the timer to run out. this was bad for gameplay in rogue spear and it the main reason i played with a 3:00 timer on rounds.

in games where you can respawn, however, this isnt a problem at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace42 View Post
I mean, that's fine and all. There's no reason why there shouldn't be a game / mod orientated in such a way that it caters for people who are inclined to be campers - there's plenty of games out there for non-campers. It's just amusing that a big chunk of people here try and draw out from their personal preference arguments of "realism" and "rationality" and "teamwork" etc etc etc.
this game does not cater to people who want to camp. it caters to people who want to use tactics and strategy to win the fight. i am not interested in twitch battles. i want teamwork and tactics. the best times in PR are when i have my squad in perfect position and the enemy has done exactly what i anticipated. it's rape time at that point and that's the whole reason to have a strategy.

like i said...i do not like twitch FPS games. they bore the piss out of me. that's why i play PR. and believe me, i realize i am in the minority (a very small minority) of FPS players. like the devs have always said...PR is not for everyone. it's made for a niche audience.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PFunk View Post
I think camping is just a pejorative word used by unimaginative gamers who don't like the concept of their quarry actually being good. If you ever hear these people die its cause of cheating or someone else being stupid or in effect using an illegitimate tactic, usually one which takes advantage of someone's bumbling charge through enemies with no regard to his flanks.
nicely put!

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Old 03-27-2009, 02:33 PM   #35
Cassius
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Default Re: Can anyone explain why we capture flags?

Why must there be war

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Old 03-27-2009, 03:49 PM   #36
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Default Re: Can anyone explain why we capture flags?

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Why must there be war
^^ lols...


"I love the smell of napalm in the morning. You know, one time we had a hill bombed, for 12 hours. When it was all over, I walked up. We didn't find one of 'em, not one stinkin' dink body. The smell, you know that gasoline smell, the whole hill. Smelled like... victory. Someday this war's gonna end... "
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