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Old 04-20-2008, 08:52 PM   #1
DavidP
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Default Do all Conventional Factions have to play the Same?

After Playing PR for more than a Year now, I've noticed that Nearly Every Conventional Faction plays in nearly the same manner. All the Kits are nearly Mirror Balanced and All the Maps are aswell. Now i know this is for Balance Issues and all but it does gets boring after a while, I mean every single round of Kashan and Ejod is almost the same, Move here watch here attack here, Etc etc. It becomes predictable, I cant tell you how many times i've went through the same exact spot on Kashan and found a Rally, Or Sniper, Or whatever.(You know the bathroom stalls in the bunkers? Yeah thats rally point city)This is one of the reasons why i love play as Insurgents, Everything is so random, You never know where the caches are gonna be, You never know what weapon you'll find, You never know where the enemy will be. You lack a few things but make it up in other areas.

Right now Assault Rifles are zeroed to 300m no matter what other differences they have(I.E. Damage, Ammo type, Ammo capacity) Thats not bad but what thrill is there when you can compute everything mathematically? I had a Firefight a few nights ago on Ghost Train from one end of the bridge to the other, Both sides were popping up firing a few rounds and ducking. It was a stalemate for 30 minutes, Until the Round Ended. On Basrah that does not Happen, Because there are so many ways to Flank, Nothing Lasts Longer for more than 5 minutes. I was able to hold out with my squad which had consisted of 3 RPG gunners against an Endless onslaught of Brits for 3 minutes before they finally got us with the Challenger. That was Fun(We blew up lot of Land Rovers and Apc's)

This is fun, This is Randomness and Chaos! All organized in a way that Makes teamwork possible! Thats what made .5 Basrah Awesome, Thats What Made .6 Mestia Great, And thats what PR needs more of, Chaos!

Things need to be Unbalanced just a bit for each side, Like it is now for Insurgents vs Brits/US. Not just Damage, Recoil, Deviation! Kit Loadouts, Vehicles, And The Soldier himself. That would make things more fun and more realistic.

So who Agrees with me that The Conventional Factions should have more differences between each other?(Not counting Equipment)
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Old 04-20-2008, 09:09 PM   #2
Expendable Grunt

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Everything in life can be computed mathematically. Sunsets are nothing more than waves at a certain frequency, and love is a chemical equation soon to be in over-the-counter form.


Now onto the subject, not every faction is supposed to play the same, HOWEVER players seem to think they should. MEC should be far more static than they currently are, owing to the G3 not being a stellar assault rifle, but a great pre-arranged killer. Now, if they had more realistic F1's, it would be a bit better I'd think.


Former [DM] captain.

The fact that people are poor or discriminated against doesn't necessarily endow them with any special qualities of justice, nobility, charity or compassion. - Saul Alinsky
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Old 04-20-2008, 09:22 PM   #3
[R-DEV]Rhino
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Two Words, Qwai River.

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Old 04-20-2008, 09:28 PM   #4
Rudd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Expendable Grunt View Post
Everything in life can be computed mathematically. Sunsets are nothing more than waves at a certain frequency, and love is a chemical equation soon to be in over-the-counter form.
and there was me thinking you were cynical

I am inclined to agree, most conventional maps tend to go in one of a few ways and insurgency is brilliant because of how it has a far larger number of permutations.


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Old 04-20-2008, 09:49 PM   #5
IAJTHOMAS

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Quote:
Originally Posted by [R-DEV]Rhino View Post
Two Words, Qwai River.
I don't think his point is made at asymettrical balance as such, I think he's saying if you took x map, say Qwai, between US and China, and replaced it with Brit v MEC gave them the same assets (I know there aren't always exact replicas available in game, but imagine there are for arguments sake), rounds would play out broadly the same, despite the armies being different. No real adaptation in tactics would be needed to acount for a different force.

What he says is partially true. The only main issues are brit APCs aren't amphibious, so you to adapt to that, the M16 doesn't have full auto, so spray and pray room clearances have to be more measured 3-burst affairs, the G3 full auto kicks alot and has fewer bullets, which again means a bit less short range spraying and requires you to make a few, high powered shots counts, rather than say taking 3, with 2 probably going to hit as will say the SA80 or the QZB, or even the m16.

Basically i would say, the aren't identical, but the differences tend to only show themsleves in specific circumstances which don't always occur frequently. Over all a game between 2 conventional forces will play very much the same in a strategic sense, no matter what flag the army is fighting under.
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Old 04-20-2008, 10:06 PM   #6
Jaymz
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Basically you want more asymmetry, which is definitely planned

"Clear the battlefield and let me see, All the profit from our victory." - Greg Lake
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Old 04-20-2008, 10:54 PM   #7
DavidP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [R-DEV]Jaymz View Post
Basically you want more asymmetry, which is definitely planned
Ding Ding Ding! We have a Winner! Please tell me .8!
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Old 04-20-2008, 11:43 PM   #8
IAJTHOMAS

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Quote:
Originally Posted by [R-DEV]Jaymz View Post
Basically you want more asymmetry, which is definitely planned
Yeah, i was trying to distinguish between asymetrical balance in terms of numbers and class of equipment and that between the same class of equipment with different characteristics.

Qwai is brilliant example of the former, and the differences in assault rifle are a good example of the later. I think its the later that will make the difference in allowing different factions to be played differently in all circumstances, rather than making it asset dependent.
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Old 04-21-2008, 12:27 AM   #9
ArthurF94
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Solution:
BIGGER MAPS, MORE DIVERSITY
Oh, and bigger maps doesn't mean tanks, planes, helicopters, apcs.
Lets keep some maps(even if big) just down to trucks and infantry.
Diversity, will lead to more roads, hideouts, and attack options.

The will to fight for all the CRAZY NIGHTS!
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Old 04-21-2008, 03:22 AM   #10
PFunk

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArthurF94 View Post
Solution:
BIGGER MAPS, MORE DIVERSITY
Oh, and bigger maps doesn't mean tanks, planes, helicopters, apcs.
Lets keep some maps(even if big) just down to trucks and infantry.
Diversity, will lead to more roads, hideouts, and attack options.
I definitely like the idea of lots of big maps with only trucks, jeeps, and APCs, or maybe even one transport chopper. Jets are cool but infantry is why I play this game and I like the idea of a level where anyone with a Rifleman ammo kit can compete.
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